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No, it means that J2807 assumes 300 lb of occupants (also 70 lb of towing equipment in half tons) when testing for GCWR and calculating tow rating. Payload is for an empty truck full of fuel. Let me give you an example.
Hey guys. I was playing around with that awesome Ford VIN Towing calculator and I came across something.
So the SAE J2807 "assumes minimum of 300lbs passenger weight".
Now does this mean, if I have 400lbs of passengers (myself, wife and two kids), that I would only use 100lbs for my payload calculation?
J2807 doesnt really have anything to do with payload calculations. The payload is whatever it is. J2807 has to do with calculating the maximum trailer weight the truck can tow.
They determine the GCWR of the truck and then subtract the 300 lbs of passengers as well as some amount of weight for the weight distribution hitch to arrive at the maximum trailer weight. As long as the truck has enough payload to support the 300 lbs of passengers, the hitch, and the tongue weight of the trailer it is fine.
Clearly a rookie here, but I want to make sure I completely understand (possibly order and will be towing)...
J2807 does not apply at all to payload calculations? It is only for tow ratings?
For example, if the truck has 1800 lbs payload, that does NOT already have factored in 370lbs of passengers and towing gear, is that correct?
If I actually loaded the truck with 370lbs then I have to subtract that from the 1800lbs? So remaining payload is 1430?
Correct. The payload on the door sticker only includes the weight of the truck itself and fuel in the tank. It does not include passengers.
However, when Ford calculates the maximum trailer weight for your truck, they do it per the J2807 standard, which means the trailer weight is determined by subtracting the assumed 300 lbs of passengers from the GCWR as well as the weight of the hitch. So say your GCWR is 17000 lbs. The truck is 5000 lbs. They do the math and say 17000-5000-300-70 = 11630 lb max trailer weight.
The truck needs to have enough payload to carry all of it though. So J2807 assumes a 10% tongue weight for the trailer. The truck has to have enough payload to carry the 300 lbs of passengers, the 70 lb hitch, and a 1,162.5 lb tongue for a total of 1533 lbs. If you dont have at least 1533 lb of payload then the maximum trailer weight is lowered until it falls in line with your payload. So payload is factored in, but the payload is calculated prior to J2807.
This is why its nice that GM puts the door stickers on the trucks that now tell you the individual GCWR, payload, and max trailer weight for your specific truck. There are no questions. They do the entire calculation and print it on the sticker for each truck.
At the end of the day though, it doesnt matter. Your trailer is not always going to be 10% tongue weight and you might have more than 300 lbs of passengers. You have to do the calculation yourself for your specific setup to arrive at a safe number.
Last edited by mass-hole; Aug 30, 2022 at 04:56 PM.
Correct. The payload on the door sticker only includes the weight of the truck itself and fuel in the tank. It does not include passengers.
However, when Ford calculates the maximum trailer weight for your truck, they do it per the J2807 standard, which means the trailer weight is determined by subtracting the assumed 300 lbs of passengers from the GCWR as well as the weight of the hitch. So say your GCWR is 17000 lbs. The truck is 5000 lbs. They do the math and say 17000-5000-300-70 = 11630 lb max trailer weight.
The truck needs to have enough payload to carry all of it though. So J2807 assumes a 10% tongue weight for the trailer. The truck has to have enough payload to carry the 300 lbs of passengers, the 70 lb hitch, and a 1,162.5 lb tongue for a total of 1533 lbs. If you dont have at least 1533 lb of payload then the maximum trailer weight is lowered until it falls in line with your payload. So payload is factored in, but the payload is calculated prior to J2807.
This is why its nice that GM puts the door stickers on the trucks that now tell you the individual GCWR, payload, and max trailer weight for your specific truck. There are no questions. They do the entire calculation and print it on the sticker for each truck.
At the end of the day though, it doesnt matter. Your trailer is not always going to be 10% tongue weight and you might have more than 300 lbs of passengers. You have to do the calculation yourself for your specific setup to arrive at a safe number.
Super helpful and thank you. Running the calcs myself but even then still hard to get your estimates.
Just keep in mind that J2807 assumes 10% tongue weight on all calculations for conventional towing. Not all trailers tow well at 10% tongue weight. Center wheeled trailers, those that have the axles equidistant between the hitch and rear of the trailer, think travel trailer, require more tongue weight to prevent sway. Trailers where weight is centered over the axles can get by with less than 10% TW, think boat trailer. So when shopping, keep this in mind so you are in the right ballpark for your payload. J2807 is based for the most part on equipment trailers.
If you are doing anything close to this J2807 rating you should scale it instead, in my opinion. There are Cat scales all over the place mostly truck stops.
Not a lot of leeway and the hitch set ups aren’t that great to begin with.
SAE J2807 Question
