ChaosFactor

Ford Service HELP! My GPS/Navigation is broken - I have the dreaded "NO GPS" in the red circle with the slash thru it. Truck is just out of warranty about 3.5 years old but only 15k miles. Bummer for me.

Complicating matters is that I recently upgraded my rims/tires with a slighty larger setup. Tire profile is 1" larger. I'm fairly certain that the "NO GPS" issue happened during the Tire Upgrade.

I tried disconnecting the battery and master reset - several times. Did not work. Satellite radio still gets signal.

Took it to the dealer to diagnose. Tech notes:

"pulled diagnostic trouble code #U3000 from accessory protocol interface module. Checked TSB 13-9-22 and verified software level has been updated. Performed reflash to A.P.I.M to latest calibration level. Performed pin point test and found no response from antenna. Inspected antenna connections at right side of dash, ohm out OK. Satellite antenna is hard-wired to the audio control module. Will need to remove for inspection."


At this point they call me and say the work estimate is going upto $350 because the need to disassemble the dash. But it was late in the day and I need the truck for a trip and didn't really want them to pull the dash apart and possible leave me stranded.

Now, I've heard of lots of people having problems with their GPS after a tire upgrade, and really don't want to end up wasting a bunch of money not fixing the problem.
When I tried to talk to the service manager about this, he's not very helpful, most likely because they don't see problems like this often. He even told me that there was "no way that the GPS is keyed into the tires rotation/direction and could not effect the navigation".

Well, we know thats wrong and the map uses dead reconing in some way to improve accuracy. I can set the "position" and direction in one of the NAV menu options and also "calibrate speed". If I'm on a road with not too tight turns, it does a reasonable job of keeping me on the road in the right spot. If the turn is sharper, then it loses track and I'm of in the weeds...

An old post by Ford Service (on some other F150 site) made a statement that this is a known issue after tire/wheel changes and that the "GPS software needed be updated, not SYNC, and not the MAP". But they provided no other reference information other than to just tell the service manage that "Ford Service" said there is an update.

So, should I continue to dump hundreds of dollars into the Ford dealership? Can Ford Service on this website provide additional direction?

Another observation is that the wheel shop had a TPMS tool to train the TPMS. My guess is that this tool generates a radio signal of some kind. One just holds it near the tire to train and push a button. I suppose its possible that some odd interaction from the TPMS tool overloaded the GPS antenna input on the NAV unit? You know, like and EMP - Electro Magnetic Pulse. (just like in the Matrix!)

Last comment. Whatever was done at the dealer, the ecoboost is more more responsive. I had what I'd consider fairly significant turbo lag, and amazingly, the truck felt much snapper on the way home - so thats something to be happy about. Any way to check ECU revisions without a tuner? Tech didn't mention updating ECU, but maybe it happens as a side effect?

VIN 1FTVW 1ET 3CKE 23xxx
DOM 7/12
Sony Navigation

FordIVTteam

Hey ChaosFactor,

A dealership is going to be your best bet for a resolution. At this point I would recommend visiting a different dealership in your area: http://owner.ford.com/dealer-locator...160206194959:s

If there aren't any other dealerships in the area you would like to go to, you can request the service advisor submit a ticket to their technical assistance for direction. There was some information that came out a while ago specific to this issue and we were advised to refer customers to the dealership.

If you don't have any luck there, please send a PM with your complete VIN and I can check it out.

Whitney

cford716

How long did you disconnect the battery for?
I had the offset problem when I bought the truck, new, stock tires. Dealership could not find a problem, after 6 months found out about the battery disconnect and that fixed it for over 2 years no problems.
I recently put new tires, about 1" larger on and the offset came back. I disconnected the battery for about 30 minutes. First thing j got was NO GPS. After about a minute if came back but so did the offset. Disconnected the battery again but for about 2 hours. So far the offset is gone.
Personally before you spend a bunch of money I would disconnect the battery got a couple of hours first. If it was working before your tires and then it wasn't, it doesn't take a genius to figure out its another, in a long history of positioning problems. Why these inputs have not been deleted in SYNC updates is beyond me. This has caused more problems than it's worth and stand alone units that don't have these inputs are as or more accurate.
These are trucks, not a Prius, people change tire sizes. This shouldn't make your expensive GPS useless.

ChaosFactor

I unplugged the battery a couple different times. From between a few minutes to a couple/three hours. I can try an overnight drain to see if that helps.

There is something thats alive in the GPS system though. In addition to the NO GPU symbol, I had also lost the clock - its was just blank. Then I went on a fairly long trip (>250 miles) and the truck location was being tracked by the dead reckoning/speed sensor but *way* off actual location. Clock still dead. Then, after starting up the truck one day where I was staying for a few days, the clock time re-appeared with the correct time and the position of the truck was where It was suppose to be. However, the NO GPS symbol still appeared and when I drove the truck it eventually went off into the weeds again, but still in the general vicinity of were I am. So, its obviously picking up something. Just unable to get a full lock on GPS signal.

ChaosFactor

Can you say what the "some information that came out a while ago" specifically was?

I can go to another dealer, but would prefer not to. I live in a pretty small town and keeping things local helps my kids friends families stay employed, whether they are service techs or managers. Once they understand whats going on, they will do a better job the next time. Ford Corporate has a responsibility in this too. I appreciate your help in this matter.

FordIVTteam

Hey ChaosFactor,

Since we aren't trained Ford technicians, we are unable to go into specifics. However, it sounds like your dealership is on the right track. There's no need to visit a different one if you don't want to, but I do suggest continuing to work with them on this issue.

Rebecca

ChaosFactor

Recommending a different dealer suggests that they may not be doing the correct diagnostic work. Whitney alluded to knowledge of an issue. What was this issue? There was another FORD IVT person that said to do a software update on "the GPS. Not SYNC and not the MAP".

How does one update the GPS? The dealer was unaware of any such GPS update and instead started pulling apart things. I've already dropped $150. They want $200 more to disassemble the dash. I suspect that they will next start recommending the replacement of other HW components (e.g. A.P.I.M). This after simply putting larger tires on the truck? This same NO GPS after tire change complaint has been made here and on other forums, yet there appears to be no awareness of it at my dealer.

FordIVTteam

Please send a PM with your VIN and I'll look in to it.

Whitney

FordEver

Just a 'way out there thought', Did you try resetting the SIM card or is it busted or even still in the slot?

ChaosFactor

My version, 2012 with Sony Navigation, does not have an SD card (I think they are SD).