Just tell us your under invoice price paid.
10-28-2015, 09:38 PM
#141
Senior Member
I posted this a couple of weeks ago, and few people were interested in what it exposed. Maybe the people on this thread will appreciate knowing how and why there is such a disparity in "invoice" pricing.
Basically, invoice price and 3% holdback is out the window. All manufacturers have closed the gap between "invoice" and window sticker so much, that there is a large amount of fat left between "dealer invoice" and "real dealer invoice". That is why they can sell below "invoice" and not go broke.
You have to read the links to understand what is really happening, if you really care to know.
https://www.f150forum.com/f118/resea...search-317608/
Basically, invoice price and 3% holdback is out the window. All manufacturers have closed the gap between "invoice" and window sticker so much, that there is a large amount of fat left between "dealer invoice" and "real dealer invoice". That is why they can sell below "invoice" and not go broke.
You have to read the links to understand what is really happening, if you really care to know.
https://www.f150forum.com/f118/resea...search-317608/
The following users liked this post:
Cobra Gt (10-29-2015)
10-29-2015, 06:27 AM
#142
Senior Member
The Clark Howard link is a very interesting link. That's the approach I will use, starting the last week of the month and contact dealers with in a couple hours drive on Monday and they will need to get me their out the door price by Wednesday close of business......then follow up with the non responders the next day. Then of course thank all of the responders after the process. And of course, I will need an email to take with me to sign the papers.
10-29-2015, 06:38 AM
#143
Senior Member
The Clark Howard link is a very interesting link. That's the approach I will use, starting the last week of the month and contact dealers with in a couple hours drive on Monday and they will need to get me their out the door price by Wednesday close of business......then follow up with the non responders the next day. Then of course thank all of the responders after the process. And of course, I will need an email to take with me to sign the papers.
10-29-2015, 06:47 AM
#144
Senior Member
Yes, ordering is not what I plan to do. There are plenty of 2015 loaded XLT's and Lariat's optioned like I want with in 2 hours of me, at least 6 Dealers.
10-29-2015, 08:53 AM
#145
Senior Member
You can't prove a negative.
The proof that Ford is giving the discount shows on the VOC as "SP DLR ACCT ADJ" and "SP FLT ACCT CR". I have several Fleet Sales "Vehicle Order Confirmation" sheets from 2014 and 2015, which shows the discount from Ford totaling between $1,500 and $2,500. Again I can provide proof, but it seems to me that you don't want to accept the fact that the information is out there that the Dealers are giving BIG discounts through their Fleet Sales. I'm beginning to think that YOU are a dealer!! Numbers don't lie, especially to a Forensic Accountant. Do you have any documentation to prove that these BIG discounts are from Ford?
The proof that Ford is giving the discount shows on the VOC as "SP DLR ACCT ADJ" and "SP FLT ACCT CR". I have several Fleet Sales "Vehicle Order Confirmation" sheets from 2014 and 2015, which shows the discount from Ford totaling between $1,500 and $2,500. Again I can provide proof, but it seems to me that you don't want to accept the fact that the information is out there that the Dealers are giving BIG discounts through their Fleet Sales. I'm beginning to think that YOU are a dealer!! Numbers don't lie, especially to a Forensic Accountant. Do you have any documentation to prove that these BIG discounts are from Ford?
2015 Model Year
http://www.fleet.ford.com/edms/conte...00cad981ce8060
2016 Model Year
http://www.fleet.ford.com/edms/conte...00cad9823b4fb4
So, does this help prove that the Dealers are providing the biggest portion of the $6,000-$7,000 below invoice pricing for Commercial Fleet Sales? So, do the facts now show that the "Dealer Invoice" is just smoke & mirrors as Clark Howard's article explains and that the Dealerships are actually paying several thousand dollars below "invoice price" through monthly and quarterly incentives. I even read an article that many Ford Dealerships in rural parts of the country are upset at Ford's step incentives because they can't compete with high volume dealerships that are receiving these quarterly incentives from Ford. The high volume dealerships are selling vehicles at a "loss" in order to actually get these BIG "$1,000 per vehicle" bonuses if they meet certain sales quotas. Selling 5-10 vehicles at a loss of $2,000 each only costs the dealership $10,000-$20,000, but the rewards of meeting the incentive quota for a dealership that sells 1,200 vehicles per year could mean a bonus of $1.2 million.
Last edited by Stans2000; 10-29-2015 at 09:16 AM.
10-29-2015, 10:16 AM
#146
I totally agree with you guys. Ford's investors have been told that Ford make over $10000 pure profit for every F150 sold. That's why despite poor sales of other models Ford never needed any government rescue money a few years ago.
And there is no way Ford will let dealership lose money and go out of business. Ford is helping the dealers on many other costs as well, which all come from the thick profits even they are selling the "Below Invoice".
I have no complaint on how Ford do business, this is part of their success. Yet I really do not like some salesman pushing me as if I do not even read online. Telling me their rock hard bottom line is 400 dollars above invoice. And hinting me that I am stealing their money if I buy below invoice.
And there is no way Ford will let dealership lose money and go out of business. Ford is helping the dealers on many other costs as well, which all come from the thick profits even they are selling the "Below Invoice".
I have no complaint on how Ford do business, this is part of their success. Yet I really do not like some salesman pushing me as if I do not even read online. Telling me their rock hard bottom line is 400 dollars above invoice. And hinting me that I am stealing their money if I buy below invoice.
10-29-2015, 10:37 AM
#147
Senior Member
At the end of the day, the dealership has to make money, covering the overhead....if you are not in business, it's difficult to grasp all of the cost for every day a dealership is open. I own a hardware business and barely end up on the plus side.....and I get complaints about a box of screws being .50 higher than Lowes 18 miles away!
The dealer is making plenty, just look at the big new show room and all of the wasted money!!!
The dealer is making plenty, just look at the big new show room and all of the wasted money!!!
10-29-2015, 05:20 PM
#148
Senior Member
And the proof that Clark Howard nailed it is right here.
Thanks to Maybe2ndFord for the find. Looks like X-plan for everyone!
Thanks to Maybe2ndFord for the find. Looks like X-plan for everyone!
Ford Set to Kick-Off Massive Price Promotion Next Week
By Paul Ausick October 28, 2015 3:03 pm EDT
Email For two months beginning on November 3rd, Ford Motor Co. (NYSE: F) will be offering most of its vehicles at a price around $200 above invoice. Dubbed the “Friends & Neighbors Pricing Event,” the promotion runs through January 4, 2016.
The best part of promotion is that all the other incentives from are still available. Both Bloomberg and Automotive News claim to have received copies of the guide that Ford sent out to dealers. Bloomberg noted that the promotional pricing will be available for 2014, 2015, and 2016 models with a few exceptions.
Ford is going after market share not only with added incentives, but also spending heavily on advertising. The promotion makes sense given that Ford’s market share has dipped from 15.9% in the U.S. at the end of 2013 and has dwindled to 15.1% at the end of the third quarter of this year. A lot of the share loss is down to the redesigned F-150 and the new Edge, both of which took vehicles out of inventory as the design changes were being implemented. U.S. sales finally broke loose in September, up 23% year-over-year.
According to Automotive News, guide indicates that discounts of up to 10% may be combined with other incentives and that dealers could earn up to $471 more for every 2015 F-150 that they sell. Here’s how the pricing—Ford’s so-called “X-plan pricing”—works according to Automotive News:
Ford’s margin on the 2015 F-150s has been estimated at more than $13,000, more than enough to absorb the coming promotion. Right now, regaining market share, not just for the F-150, but for all its vehicles takes precedence over margins. Besides, fourth quarter margins were going to be lighter anyway, so hiding the promotional costs can be easier to explain.
By Paul Ausick October 28, 2015 3:03 pm EDT
Email For two months beginning on November 3rd, Ford Motor Co. (NYSE: F) will be offering most of its vehicles at a price around $200 above invoice. Dubbed the “Friends & Neighbors Pricing Event,” the promotion runs through January 4, 2016.
The best part of promotion is that all the other incentives from are still available. Both Bloomberg and Automotive News claim to have received copies of the guide that Ford sent out to dealers. Bloomberg noted that the promotional pricing will be available for 2014, 2015, and 2016 models with a few exceptions.
Ford is going after market share not only with added incentives, but also spending heavily on advertising. The promotion makes sense given that Ford’s market share has dipped from 15.9% in the U.S. at the end of 2013 and has dwindled to 15.1% at the end of the third quarter of this year. A lot of the share loss is down to the redesigned F-150 and the new Edge, both of which took vehicles out of inventory as the design changes were being implemented. U.S. sales finally broke loose in September, up 23% year-over-year.
According to Automotive News, guide indicates that discounts of up to 10% may be combined with other incentives and that dealers could earn up to $471 more for every 2015 F-150 that they sell. Here’s how the pricing—Ford’s so-called “X-plan pricing”—works according to Automotive News:
The sale sets a maximum price that consumers would pay, though dealers can agree to sell vehicles for less. The maximum price is 99.6 percent of invoice plus a $275 administrative fee, minus any vehicle-specific incentives. That’s the same way X-plan pricing usually works, though it normally requires consumers to provide a unique personal identification number linked to a particular employee at a supplier, business partner, fleet partner or other Ford partner.
For example, a 2015 F-150 SuperCrew with four-wheel drive and a short bed has a factory invoice price of $38,273 in the Chicago area according to TrueCar.com and the Ford formula yields a maximum price plus the admin fee of $38,395. Ford is currently offering $7,050 in incentives on the truck, along with some special savings for military veterans and police veterans. Assuming just the incentives apply, that pickup will cost $31,345. Special 0% financing packages are replaced with the new promotion. Ford’s margin on the 2015 F-150s has been estimated at more than $13,000, more than enough to absorb the coming promotion. Right now, regaining market share, not just for the F-150, but for all its vehicles takes precedence over margins. Besides, fourth quarter margins were going to be lighter anyway, so hiding the promotional costs can be easier to explain.
11-05-2015, 11:43 PM
#149
Senior Member
I think the new sales event should be called "F" the F150 sales event.
I was working on a deal for a loaded Lariat at 4K under invoice before rebates on Sunday. I walked out to have dinner and get back to them later in the week. That price was posted on their website.
Today everything is updated and they are quoting the new promotion price of a few hundred dollars above invoice. I checked with a couple of other dealers and they are all lock step in the new promotion price whereas they were all advertising 3-4K under invoice last week in newspapers and on the website.
I guess I will wait until the dust settles and the ad campaign has pushed through the first wave of new customers. The loaded Lariats have been sitting on the lots since early last summer and something will have to give as we approach New Years.
I was working on a deal for a loaded Lariat at 4K under invoice before rebates on Sunday. I walked out to have dinner and get back to them later in the week. That price was posted on their website.
Today everything is updated and they are quoting the new promotion price of a few hundred dollars above invoice. I checked with a couple of other dealers and they are all lock step in the new promotion price whereas they were all advertising 3-4K under invoice last week in newspapers and on the website.
I guess I will wait until the dust settles and the ad campaign has pushed through the first wave of new customers. The loaded Lariats have been sitting on the lots since early last summer and something will have to give as we approach New Years.
11-07-2015, 12:18 AM
#150
Senior Member
How is $3,300 below invoice?
So, I've been waiting to order a 2016 Ford F-150 Lariat SuperCrew 4x4, 157" WB using the USAA Car Buying Service. The 2016 finally showed up today on Truecar.com and USAA. My price is $3,300 below invoice!! I just need a Coupon from the brochure. MSRP is $54,045.
Base $42,190
Options $5,742
Fuel Charge $86
Advertising $793
Delivery $1,195
Total Invoice $50,006
Reduction -$3,300
Rebate -$500
Military Dis -$500
Coupon -$1,000
Total $44,706
Base $42,190
Options $5,742
Fuel Charge $86
Advertising $793
Delivery $1,195
Total Invoice $50,006
Reduction -$3,300
Rebate -$500
Military Dis -$500
Coupon -$1,000
Total $44,706
Last edited by Stans2000; 11-07-2015 at 12:38 AM.