Then I guess I need you to define what % of vehicles this includes.

 

Cause I'm sure your more educated than the ford engineers who have designed one of the most sophisticated engines in history. I'd believe you if you could back this up with some technical details as to why the higher octane is going to make a significant impact on the performance/reliability of the engine.

 

In the manual for my 2.7 it recommends higher octane when pulling a trailer. It also says to buy a truck with the 5.0 if you plan on using your truck for plowing snow.

 

Just wondering how the computer adjusts for different octane fuels?

A knock sensor is just that, it senses knock and backs off timing accordingly until the knock is gone. If the sensor does not sense a knock it WILL NOT continue to advance timing until it senses it.

If the manual says 87 then run 87, the only way you will see any advantage with a higher octane fuel is if you add a tune designed to run 93. The OEM system is designed to run at 87 and will not adjust any parameters to take advantage of anything higher than 93.

My Mach 1 says nothing under 92 in the manual, on the gauge, and on the fuel door as it ran 10:1 from the factory. I tuned it based on 93 that we have here and I had a 2nd tune done for 110 race fuel. If the 150 is capable of adjusting up maybe someone should go fill up with 110 and report back about the added power.

 

Spoken like a true "magazine mechanic".....it's not just the knock sensor, obviously you have no clue about all the controls that go into these engine controls....your ANCIENT Mach 1 doesn't hold a candle to what these engine's can adjust for now. Injection timing, valve timing....etc to name just a couple. Why would the manual state to use premium fuel when towing ? If 87 is what the vehicle is tuned for from the factory, why use premium just to tow, it should make no difference if the vehicle can't adjust for it ? If the vehicle "according to you" can't adjust for premium fuel, WHY does the manual state to use it when towing with the EcoBoost ? These engines have adaptive learning strategies that adjust everything from transmission shift points to throttle input. The 4 cylinder EcoBoost states right in the manual YOU WILL lose HP (aprox. 25) when using 87 vs 93 octane....but you can still safely run 87....so how did they do that one, I'm guessing the Ford engineers loaded 2 completely different fuel tables & running strategies & the vehicle magically knows what fuel you put it....BUT WAIT....according to YOU, that's not possible because the vehicle can't compensate on it's own for different octane fuels. So again....YOU WILL gain HP & TQ from using 93 vs 87 octane, you WON'T gain any MPG. Your vehicle CAN & WILL adjust injection timing, valve timing & a host of other parameters to optimize it's power curve. Your comment about using 110 race fuel is ridiculous, obviously there's a point where the octane level excedes the factory adjustment parameters & a custom tune is a must have. Forced induction engines are simple, they work like this....you will ALWAYS have a ready supply of air coming into the engine, much like a diesel, the more fuel you add, the more power you make. So by going up in octane (93 vs 87) your computer WILL adjust (to it's factory set limits) & be able to be more aggresive with injection quantity & timing because of 93 octane being more resistant to detonate, hense you get more power. This is why a custom tune on an EcoBoost will get you 70HP & 120TQ, because the air supply is already there, they just remove the factory restriction limits on injection timing advance (among other things) & raise the boost level very minimal, only about 2 more psi. Your Mach 1 is still using an external EGR system for gods sake, that's all done internally now through cam timing....OH WAIT....I forgot your engine doesn't have variable cam timing (unless you spin it way too many rpm & float the valves) then you'll have variable valve timing, along with a broken engine.

 

According to the head of fords powertrain division, the F150 makes its rated power and torque using 87. That's per Ford. When you are towing HEAVY, that is a different animal.


I am only a lowly electrical engineer, so I don't know all the in's and outs of why when towing you COULD see a benefit, but I would guess it has something to do with all of the additional fuel and air being combusted, created a lot more heat than is "normal", thus not seeing as much as a decrease in performance using a higher octane. But that is just a guess.

 

Seriously?? I bet you slapped a CAI on your truck didnt you. Didn't realize personal insults were the norm when people disagree with you delusions. Dropping your truck off to a shop and asking them to get you more hp/tq does not make you a mechanic. I've been wrenching and tunning(doing the tunning not paying someone else to do it) on cars for close to 25 years. Built more than a few engines, rear ends, transplanting of engins, etc. in my life as well.

Unless there is some form of sensor in the tank to sample the fuel there is only one way for the computer to know if there is an issue and that is when you get pre-ignition in a cylinder.

The truck is designed to run on 87. The computers parameters stop at 87. The suggestion for running premium while towing is shown for two reasons heat and load. Turbos heat the air higher than aimbiant temp. and turbos are spooled up more under load so there is more heat. What causes detonation? That's right....heat. So since a higher grade fuel can withstand more heat before detonating it would be advisable to run the higher octane rating fuel when you are planning on doing a lot of towing. Not that it is needed but for the extra insurance.

Take your truck to the local dyno and do a run on 87. Empty the tank and fill it back with 93 and do another run. Any difference you see in numbers will be minimal at best and can easily be attributed to the change in atmospheric conditions between runs. Something else to think about, your vehicle will not dyno the same consistently. You could easily show a 10hp difference from one dyno to the next. You could even show that much difference on the same dyno on the same day if one run was done in the morning and the other later on in the day.

As for the massive gains in hp/tq by tunning an eco boost, the parameters changed while tunning are no different than the parameters changed in any other computer controlled vehicle, even my ANCIENT Mach 1. Injector pulse timming, timming advance, etc. There is room for improvement over ANY factory tune as they make 1 tune for all of the trucks so they keep them conservative to compensate for manufacturing variances, vehicles that will be at different altitudes, and for engine longevity. Hell I tuned my Mach, which was factory rated at 305 hp at the flywheel, to 330 to the tires so there is always power to be picked up by adjusting what Ford put in it.

 

DING DING DING! We have a winner.

In some instances the heavier load, which in turn makes the turbos create more boost has a side effect of creating more HEAT. You can safely tow on 87 since there are ancient knock sensors in these highly advanced space age engines that will pull timming to stop the detonation and allow the vehicle to operate normally with a slight power loss. The power loss coming as a result of the retard in timming that the knock sensor told the ECU about. Not that magical RON testing lab built into the gas tank is reporting to the ECU that there test concludes you are running 87.

 

You got me bud.....keep on turning those wrenches....& I'll keep on solving problems for all the worlds OEM's....oh I forgot to mention I worked for Ford Motor Co. for 9 years before taking my current job testing & building engines for all the OEM's & aftermarket teams such as Roush. Those "dyno" runs you talk about being in accurate, we'll all my engines are built & run in rooms where we monitor about 200 sensors & transducers at a time. We try to reproduce KNOWN problems & figure out a fix before a recall must be issued, or we simply find the limits doing everything you can think of INCLUDING running everything from E85 to 70 octane (that's right, 70 octane) to fuel loaded with so much MMT it should be put on a space rocket. The engine CAN & WILL compensate for changes in octane.....as tested in a controlled environment, not a sloppy *** dyno where how tight you strap the vehicle down can give you 20HP. If you like I'll take some pics tomorrow of our Ecoboost engines & post them up because I know you don't believe me.....maybe you can post up some pics of that ragged *** dyno that you test stuff on.

 

Well now. This should be an interesting argument. Waiting for data sheets and proof from all sides.