87 Ethanol Free or 93 Premium 10% Ethanol
05-22-2019, 10:18 AM
#22
Senior Member
OK so biggest thing I notice around me is when the temp is higher than _____ the engine doesn't run as well on 87. Yes it starts fine, it doesn't stutter or stumble. but it doesn't wind out well either. etc etc. And my mpg goes down.
For for me that ____ is north of 90F or so. It's always noticeable above 95F. For me that turns into late June through early September. It is I will admit less noticeable on the highway - so long road trip 87 won't matter so much. NO way in hell would I tow or haul a bunch of stull long distance on 87 when the temp is over 90F. SO there is that.
Now, put in 93 and it runs great any time. But this shines mostly when the temp is over 90F. And it makes the most difference in city traffic. But mpg goes up, it runs happier, and the like. starting next month I suspect I'll be moving to 93 octane on the daily fill. One thing I've not tried as it often isn't worth it - is to put octane booster on 87 octane fuel. I can't imagine that will work out well dollars wise.
I also often use Sam's fuel - why, around me almost all the fuel stations get the same base fuel from the same valero refinery.
For for me that ____ is north of 90F or so. It's always noticeable above 95F. For me that turns into late June through early September. It is I will admit less noticeable on the highway - so long road trip 87 won't matter so much. NO way in hell would I tow or haul a bunch of stull long distance on 87 when the temp is over 90F. SO there is that.
Now, put in 93 and it runs great any time. But this shines mostly when the temp is over 90F. And it makes the most difference in city traffic. But mpg goes up, it runs happier, and the like. starting next month I suspect I'll be moving to 93 octane on the daily fill. One thing I've not tried as it often isn't worth it - is to put octane booster on 87 octane fuel. I can't imagine that will work out well dollars wise.
I also often use Sam's fuel - why, around me almost all the fuel stations get the same base fuel from the same valero refinery.
05-22-2019, 01:31 PM
#24
Senior Member
OK so biggest thing I notice around me is when the temp is higher than _____ the engine doesn't run as well on 87. Yes it starts fine, it doesn't stutter or stumble. but it doesn't wind out well either. etc etc. And my mpg goes down.
For for me that ____ is north of 90F or so. It's always noticeable above 95F. For me that turns into late June through early September. It is I will admit less noticeable on the highway - so long road trip 87 won't matter so much. NO way in hell would I tow or haul a bunch of stull long distance on 87 when the temp is over 90F. SO there is that.
Now, put in 93 and it runs great any time. But this shines mostly when the temp is over 90F. And it makes the most difference in city traffic. But mpg goes up, it runs happier, and the like. starting next month I suspect I'll be moving to 93 octane on the daily fill. One thing I've not tried as it often isn't worth it - is to put octane booster on 87 octane fuel. I can't imagine that will work out well dollars wise.
I also often use Sam's fuel - why, around me almost all the fuel stations get the same base fuel from the same valero refinery.
For for me that ____ is north of 90F or so. It's always noticeable above 95F. For me that turns into late June through early September. It is I will admit less noticeable on the highway - so long road trip 87 won't matter so much. NO way in hell would I tow or haul a bunch of stull long distance on 87 when the temp is over 90F. SO there is that.
Now, put in 93 and it runs great any time. But this shines mostly when the temp is over 90F. And it makes the most difference in city traffic. But mpg goes up, it runs happier, and the like. starting next month I suspect I'll be moving to 93 octane on the daily fill. One thing I've not tried as it often isn't worth it - is to put octane booster on 87 octane fuel. I can't imagine that will work out well dollars wise.
I also often use Sam's fuel - why, around me almost all the fuel stations get the same base fuel from the same valero refinery.
Last edited by w00t692; 05-22-2019 at 01:33 PM.
05-22-2019, 02:19 PM
#25
Senior Member
Hi All
Have used the E51 available here in AZ with the 5 star 93 octane performance/tow calibration
Calculates to about 100+ octane fuel
Performs much better than the 91 octane E10
Fuel mileage about 10% lower than with 91 octane E10
Some folks dislike the ethanol based fuels
I personally prefer them due to their much higher octane specs & cylinder cooling effects
Have also used the 5 star E30 calibration in both of my 2018 3.5L ECOBOOST vehicles
They have nearly 600 hp & 700 lb ft of torque at the crank with this calibration
Just sayin
Have used the E51 available here in AZ with the 5 star 93 octane performance/tow calibration
Calculates to about 100+ octane fuel
Performs much better than the 91 octane E10
Fuel mileage about 10% lower than with 91 octane E10
Some folks dislike the ethanol based fuels
I personally prefer them due to their much higher octane specs & cylinder cooling effects
Have also used the 5 star E30 calibration in both of my 2018 3.5L ECOBOOST vehicles
They have nearly 600 hp & 700 lb ft of torque at the crank with this calibration
Just sayin
05-22-2019, 03:20 PM
#26
Senior Member
Hi All
Have used the E51 available here in AZ with the 5 star 93 octane performance/tow calibration
Calculates to about 100+ octane fuel
Performs much better than the 91 octane E10
Fuel mileage about 10% lower than with 91 octane E10
Some folks dislike the ethanol based fuels
I personally prefer them due to their much higher octane specs & cylinder cooling effects
Have also used the 5 star E30 calibration in both of my 2018 3.5L ECOBOOST vehicles
They have nearly 600 hp & 700 lb ft of torque at the crank with this calibration
Just sayin
Have used the E51 available here in AZ with the 5 star 93 octane performance/tow calibration
Calculates to about 100+ octane fuel
Performs much better than the 91 octane E10
Fuel mileage about 10% lower than with 91 octane E10
Some folks dislike the ethanol based fuels
I personally prefer them due to their much higher octane specs & cylinder cooling effects
Have also used the 5 star E30 calibration in both of my 2018 3.5L ECOBOOST vehicles
They have nearly 600 hp & 700 lb ft of torque at the crank with this calibration
Just sayin
from a pure engine tuning to power perspective Ethanol does work well. HOwever your ecoboost wasn't designed with E50 in mind. SO the issues I would worry about is killing your HP fuel pump and the injectors over time due to lack of lubrication. They were designed with E15 and E20 in mind.
Do they die in one year - 3 years - not sure. Do the die anyway due to excessive duty times and maxed out flow requirements? Probably
But that's the only major issue I see with adding more ethanol - well that and you use alot.
05-22-2019, 03:36 PM
#27
Senior Member
from a pure engine tuning to power perspective Ethanol does work well. HOwever your ecoboost wasn't designed with E50 in mind. SO the issues I would worry about is killing your HP fuel pump and the injectors over time due to lack of lubrication. They were designed with E15 and E20 in mind.
Do they die in one year - 3 years - not sure. Do the die anyway due to excessive duty times and maxed out flow requirements? Probably
But that's the only major issue I see with adding more ethanol - well that and you use alot.
Do they die in one year - 3 years - not sure. Do the die anyway due to excessive duty times and maxed out flow requirements? Probably
But that's the only major issue I see with adding more ethanol - well that and you use alot.
Everything we produced had to be ethanol compatible up to 100% as required by GM, Ford, Toyota, Bosch & Chrysler
Not worried about shortening the life of any fuel system items
Have used at least an E50 ethanol mix in all 6 3.5L ECOBOOST vehicles I have owned
First one was a 2011 F150
Drove it over 100,000 miles with no Issues
No issues with any of my ECOBOOST vehicles & all were run for the entire time I owned them with anywhere from E30 to E85 ethanol mixes
So I am not worried at all about the life of the fuel system components on any of my vehicles
E51 costs $2.499 & 91 octane E10 premium is $3.899 here in Arizona
So fuel cost is lower & vehicles runs better
WIN-WIN for me anyway!!
Just sayin
05-22-2019, 04:07 PM
#28
Senior Member
parker or eaton or ? I used to do integration engineering in automotive and moved to aviation.
The fuel pumps and injectors we used on the Direct Injection test engines all needed a minimum lubricity requirement in the fuel - anything past E50 wouldn't meet that need.
Now I suspect the pumps don't mind it - I mean the bearings are sealed anyway. But as far as a warranty requirement minimum - E50 was always the limit.
Now the flex fuel engine (N/A engines) pumps are meant to run E100. as are the injectors but they don't need much and the pumps don't do the pressures of a DI engine.
Different pressures etc.
There's a number of ecoboosts that fail High Pressure pumps and a common thought is lack of fuel lubricity.
Course I know a guy that put 2 oz of 30Wt into is gas tank with every fill up too, so there are extremes on either side.
I have to ask a different question. At that power level did you move up a line size in the fuel system. Tank to HP pump?
The fuel pumps and injectors we used on the Direct Injection test engines all needed a minimum lubricity requirement in the fuel - anything past E50 wouldn't meet that need.
Now I suspect the pumps don't mind it - I mean the bearings are sealed anyway. But as far as a warranty requirement minimum - E50 was always the limit.
Now the flex fuel engine (N/A engines) pumps are meant to run E100. as are the injectors but they don't need much and the pumps don't do the pressures of a DI engine.
Different pressures etc.
There's a number of ecoboosts that fail High Pressure pumps and a common thought is lack of fuel lubricity.
Course I know a guy that put 2 oz of 30Wt into is gas tank with every fill up too, so there are extremes on either side.
I have to ask a different question. At that power level did you move up a line size in the fuel system. Tank to HP pump?
05-22-2019, 04:50 PM
#29
Senior Member
parker or eaton or ? I used to do integration engineering in automotive and moved to aviation.
The fuel pumps and injectors we used on the Direct Injection test engines all needed a minimum lubricity requirement in the fuel - anything past E50 wouldn't meet that need.
Now I suspect the pumps don't mind it - I mean the bearings are sealed anyway. But as far as a warranty requirement minimum - E50 was always the limit.
Now the flex fuel engine (N/A engines) pumps are meant to run E100. as are the injectors but they don't need much and the pumps don't do the pressures of a DI engine.
Different pressures etc.
There's a number of ecoboosts that fail High Pressure pumps and a common thought is lack of fuel lubricity.
Course I know a guy that put 2 oz of 30Wt into is gas tank with every fill up too, so there are extremes on either side.
I have to ask a different question. At that power level did you move up a line size in the fuel system. Tank to HP pump?
The fuel pumps and injectors we used on the Direct Injection test engines all needed a minimum lubricity requirement in the fuel - anything past E50 wouldn't meet that need.
Now I suspect the pumps don't mind it - I mean the bearings are sealed anyway. But as far as a warranty requirement minimum - E50 was always the limit.
Now the flex fuel engine (N/A engines) pumps are meant to run E100. as are the injectors but they don't need much and the pumps don't do the pressures of a DI engine.
Different pressures etc.
There's a number of ecoboosts that fail High Pressure pumps and a common thought is lack of fuel lubricity.
Course I know a guy that put 2 oz of 30Wt into is gas tank with every fill up too, so there are extremes on either side.
I have to ask a different question. At that power level did you move up a line size in the fuel system. Tank to HP pump?
Therefore have adequate flow to support the 600hp figure with no mods needed
HP Fuel pump & In tank pump both have adequate flow capabilities to support that HP
The GEN 1 engines have just GDI but will support about 480hp before the HP pump fails to provide adequate flow & pressure
Worked with the engineers at Delphi when they were working fuel pumps
They designed all of them to be 100% ethanol compatible per corporate edict
We supplied fuel system parts to our customers listed previously such as O-rings, seals etc
Also did oxygen sensors (Linear & switching)
05-22-2019, 05:16 PM
#30
It could be close, at least for those of us with a $0.60 differential. It's about $20 extra per tank with a 33-gal fill. I bought a box of Boostane once, and I think the cost per bottle was $20 or so... but for 36 gallons, it might require 2 bottles to bump octane from 87 to 93. It was for a new Nissan GTR I bought in 2015, that ran in low-boost mode with 91 (it's tuned for 93). Ordered the octane booster to verify if it was the fuel or the car, and it was the former; car ran like a scalded cat with that thing. But was told it's not good for the fuel system or the engine to run octane boosters such as Boostane over the long run, due to the main chemical they use. Don't know much about that, but the car was super uncomfortable, super noisy, and with only 6 gears it screamed on the highway, so sold it right away. An expensive mistake. Anyway, I'll just bite the bullet and buy premium fuel, but it freaking hurts to do that at $3.75 (and climbing) per gallon. Sucks to be in TX but far from refineries.