Itat

I haven't read my Owner's Manual on this but I'll assume you're right in that the manual does say it's "normal" for F150 headlights to have condensation form on the inside of the lens, in the corners.

However, I stand by my earlier comment that "it's neither normal nor acceptable" in the automotive industry for headlights to have condensation inside the lens despite what Ford suggests in the manual. Do you see Toyota trucks with condensation in their headlights, or higher end cars? For that matter, walk around a crowded parking lot full of multiple manufacturers' vehicles and see how many have condensation inside the lens when your truck has it happen. My point is that it's rare and not "normal" in the industry.

Again, I didn't experience any condensation before having the HID projectors retrofitted.

I love my F150 but the headlights have been an on and off annoyance since day one. The stock halogen bulbs were horrible and after the retrofit with TRS Mini H1 projectors, the ballasts got recalled (the replacement ballasts are problematic, too, so I order potted Densos) and the lens on the passenger side gets fogged.

il_duce

Is Aston Martin high-end? http://forums.edmunds.com/discussion...light-moisture

Is McLaren high-end? http://www.mclarenlife.com/forums/mc...eadlights.html

Is a Nissan GT-R high-end? http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/topic/...-condensation/

Is Porsche high-end? http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...densation.html

Sorry, but it is normal. That was just with 5 minutes of looking...

Also notice some of the comments. Almost every one of those posts has someone that says it is covered in the manual as normal operation.

MGD

ITAT;

You could always completely seal your heads - hermetically - complete with covering and sealing the standard semi-permeable membrane that exists on ALL quality modern headlight enclosures. These large constructs have their own ecosystems - it's why it rains inside the Vehicle Assembly Building, lol. It needs to be managed.

And then watch as, over time, your heads slowly (and permanently) degrade with no way to equalize pressure or reverse any other of the cumulative atmospheric effects.

I fear that this is the only way you would be convinced - by direct experience. You are 100% free to circumvent all of the engineering that has gone into this issue.

I recommend that you only do this test on one headlight though. You will then only have to replace the one destroyed unit

Seriously - listen to these folks - they are 110% correct.


MGD

150novvette

Okay, common sense or what would appear to be common sense would say that you want to seal the housing to prevent any moisture leaks. Now, is the main reason for the venting to eliminate the pressure differences inside the housing that would be caused by temperature changes produced by the heat generated by the bulbs? Even small pressure changes would cause flexing of the adhesive sealant in the hosing which I would think over time would eventually lead to breaking the bond and cause leaks.

iRub1Out

Dude...

They are the way they are for a reason. They vent because they're designed to - designed by people a hell of a lot smarter than either one of us.

Its normal and acceptable. It happens on every make and model, even your beloved fu***** Toyota headlights.

Quit the god damned arguing and accept that your opinion is just not how the world works and that's too bad. Just because you're bothered by it doesn't mean it's not acceptable or somehow abnormal.

Itat

Venting is normal, I agree, for equalization of both pressure and temperature. Condensation indicates the venting is not working well enough to equalize the temperature differential between ambient temps and the temp inside the housing causing moisture to condense on the warmer side.

Of the 4 examples given by il_duce, 3 are complaints with advice to take it to the dealer because it's not normal. The McLaren one was about hazing on the exterior of the lens.

As I said before we'll have to agree to disagree. Debate closed. Sorry I hijacked this thread by a comment not directly about HIDs.

il_duce

Did you read ALL of the comments? There are people saying that it isn't normal...just like you are doing here. So when someone searches for this problem, they will also see your comments complaining that it isn't normal. They too will have to wade through the unwarranted complaints and faulty information before they read a post like this. There are other comments in those posts saying that IT IS normal and that IT IS in the manual. I thought about leaving the McLaren one off because the original question is about the actual hazing of the headlight. But one person mistakes the question and thinks it is about condensation. His response is:

"In certain parameters they do condensate up,if its about a 1/4 to a 1/3 they say its in line with what they expect and it does clear after about 10 minutes of driving,not ideal but it happens! The rears did have many problems in cetain climates and have been upgraded to work better as some early cars did get them shorting out."

The conversation then shifts to condensation being normal in the headlights. Once again, please read

***Another comment from that McLaren thread that is related to condensation:

"Unfortunatly its normal and the dealership will do nothing as its within the tolerances that have been set,it it doesnt clear at all then thats different,we dont like it but this is the case."

iRub1Out

The venting can't keep up if, let's say, ice or freezing rain is collecting in the corner by the turn signal.

Then that area will fog up, but only that small area where the ice has formed or snow has collected.

If its worse than just a small, isolated area then there's a larger issue - one that would indicate a failure of some kind.

If you just drive in the rain or wash your vehicle and you have fogging but very minimal temp differences then that's not supposed to happen. If its 85 outside and it rains and the temp drops to 80, then fog shows up, that's not normal.

Mine only ever fog up if its a reasonable jump. For example it was 88° here on Sunday and 20° the following morning (Iowa weather...) Had I used my HLs that morning when frost/snow had formed on them then I would fully expect fogging to occur.

Again, if the fogging is excessive (like water pooling in the housing) that's absolutely not good. However if the fog is in a corner, and isn't covering more than a small portion of the housing, that's OK - as long as there isn't enough moisture to turn into water drops.

The Machine

Fogging is normal but can be eliminated. I did have some issues on my stock headlights but as others have stated, it was only in extreme temp swings or when the lenses were coated with ice/snow. My first retrofit I had some really bad condensation but then again I didn't know then what I know now. Now I add 3 extra holes (3/8") in the back where I used to get condensation (around the turn signal bucket, the lower section of the reflector bowl, and around the orange reflector) and I cover those with pcs of Gore-Tex fabric patch which is a permeable membrane in itself. I also added 2 silica packs, one behind the turn signal and one behind the reflector bucket. I use the butyl glue liberally when sealing them back up and cut back the excess once it cools. Finally, I use the housing caps from trs to seal the back side up again. I have yet to get any condensation in the current heads for the past 6 months, I wanted to make sure I solved the problem so I took the truck to the self wash and sprayed the front end for 5 min which used to fog the old ones up really good. All the steps I take now really do make a big difference, they didn't fog at all and were crystal clear.

Newfie FX4

So, I intend on replacing my fogs with something else, the stock ones BLOW. I had PnP kits in my past vehicles (yea yea, I know. I aimed them down pretty low to try and compensate and didn't get any flashes) After some reading around there is actually a purpose to the 3000K fogs, it works better then regular apparently and I would like to try that out. Best option to go with?

I would mainly like to buy something and its just a quick changeover or install, might even go PnP again for fogs..