papa tiger

When U start up 5W20 cold the oil isn't there in sufficient quantity until oil PSI builds and floods the moving parts in the motor. Experience is that motors making a lot of noise until oil psi builds always end up bad.

Ford850

Agreed. They're not idiots. By now, they've seen enough examples from every scenario and have either adjusted to it, or would have changed the oil recommendation.

latapx

These are my own theories and are not based on any research...just my knowledge of overall engine function/design.

piston ring design - in efforts to reduce friction, some newer ring designs allow more blow by, particularly when cold.
direct injection and running rich - I've noticed this with a lot of DI vehicles. quick stabs at the throttle will produce black smoke from the tailpipe similar to diesels. This overly rich condition is bad as it breaks down the film of oil on the cylinder walls increasing cylinder wear and increasing the amount of fuel in the oil.
short trips and not warming the oil enough to burn it off - I've been meaning to install an oil temperature gauge to monitor this, but i'd be willing to bet that with the low revs used in "normal" driving of our trucks, it's take 15-20 minutes of driving for the oil to come up to temperature.

These are my thoughts...any other ideas?!?

Ron AKA

No, Google is not broke for me. I just don't want to be bothered to go on a wild goose chase. I generally do not consider forums to be a reliable source of information. The problem is you get a mix of comments from the totally unknowledgeable to experts. If you don't know which is which finding credible facts is like trying to pick fly do do out of pepper. However, I am familiar with some of the contributors at BITOG. Caterham is one of the most knowledgeable ones. His comment is accurate, and I quote:


""Shearing out of grade" is a silly and misleading comment.
Most 20wt oils have a HTHS vis of 2.6 cP, the minimum for the grade, consiquently most 20wt oils will shear out of grade. As I mentioned it is the percentage amount of shear vs the virgin oil that matters."


What he is saying is correct. The minimum HT/HS spec for 20 weight oils is 2.6. The highest quoted spec I have seen on a 20 weight is Mobil 1 with a 2.7. The minimum HT/HS for a 30 weight is 2.9. However you can get 30 weight oils with up to 3.7 for HT/HS. As Caterham says the 20 weight will almost certainly shear out of grade with use. The problem is that most UOA tests do not measure HT/HS. The good 30 weight oils start at 3.7 and have a lot more room to move without going below minimum spec.


But this is really all off topic. The problem with the EcoBoost engine is not shearing of the oil to make it thinner. It is dilution. Shear resistance means do do if your oil is full of gasoline. It is dilution resistance that you need. 20 weight oils are going to dilute down in viscosity just like 30 weight.

Ron AKA

I am afraid you do not understand how lubrication oil systems work on a gasoline engine. High pressure is a sign your oil is too thick and can't get to the bearings and valve train. Your oil pump is probably bypassing and depending on the size of your oil filter, how clean it is, and the relief valve setting, it may be bypassing as well.


Using less viscous oil at startup reduces the pressure, and increases the flow of oil. It also reduces the chance that the oil filter will bypass itself, sending unfiltered oil to the engine.

Ron AKA

Fuel dilution is a push-pull effect. In the EcoBoost there are two factors at play. The push is the direct inject over rich condition, which pushes more fuel into the oil. The pull is the PCV system which is supposed to suck the fuel out of the oil. Suspect the turbo system on the EcoBoost handicaps the effectiveness of the PCV. The driving mode; number of start ups, temperature, and services used in, also play at part in the push-pull.

papa tiger

5W20 doesn't quiet a motor down until there is +25 lbs. of oil PSI.

daveak

Noted.

itguy08

Do you not see the irony of your statement? On one hand, forums are not reliable. On the other hand, you are using forum information to prove your hypothesis that Ecoboosts are blowing up because of oil dilution.

Define "full of gasoline"? Let's do some math...

Ecoboost's oil system, 6 quarts, 192 oz. (that's what both mine to take to fill up with an oil change).

5% oil dilution = 9.6 oz, or .6 cup
10% oil dilution = 19.2 oz or 1.2 cup.

I seriously doubt that you are getting even .6 cup of gas in the oil of a properly running Ecoboost.

And even if you are, how is this problem if the engines are living to their design life of 150k? Like it or not, the industry tests out to 150k. After that, it's not going to blow up but expect to repair things along the way.

I seriously suggest that perhaps a direct injected engine is not for you if this stuff is keeping you up at night.

papa tiger

U end up with a water like mix of unburnbles mixed with the oil. The catch can on the clean air side has proved it to me. Approx 1 tablespoon every 500 miles or 14 in 7000. + 70 table spoons of oil like substance. Which means abput a quart of added burnable an unburnable substance is evac thru the clean air side. Change oil more often for improved life ot the motor.