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1997 - 2003 Ford F150 General discussion on the Ford 1997 - 2003 F150 truck.

I'm looking to do an engine swap

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Old Feb 22, 2020 | 08:39 AM
  #11  
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I agree with the others, I did a 5.4 to a 4.6 swap in a 99. I couldn't believe how much was different. If I hadn't had a complete donor truck it definitely would not have been doable.
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Old Feb 22, 2020 | 11:56 AM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by steelers06steelers
I agree with the others, I did a 5.4 to a 4.6 swap in a 99. I couldn't believe how much was different. If I hadn't had a complete donor truck it definitely would not have been doable.
This will probably come across as rude but it's not my intent or meant to be. Don't confuse what you know and can do with what can be done. It wasn't all that long ago, and may still, when going to sites like ebay for engines to swap there were places that specialized in selling, mainly from wrecks, everything related to the engine and electronics from the wrecks to do swaps. The reality is almost all of it is unnecessary. The electronics aren't the big mystery they were until not long ago. On another site a guy recently put a 2015 Coyote in to a 10th gen truck like ours. He pulled a 4.6 to put it in. He documented the entire process including splicing the Coyote harnesses in to the existing trucks harnesses. I was always under the belief that the 10th gen trucks limiting factor was the changeover from the SCP communications network to the federally mandated communications networks now required. Nope. He and others have demonstrated that bit of conventional wisdom was just wrong. 4.6 to 5.4 would even have less issues to deal with.
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Old Feb 23, 2020 | 10:27 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by River1
This will probably come across as rude but it's not my intent or meant to be. Don't confuse what you know and can do with what can be done. It wasn't all that long ago, and may still, when going to sites like ebay for engines to swap there were places that specialized in selling, mainly from wrecks, everything related to the engine and electronics from the wrecks to do swaps. The reality is almost all of it is unnecessary. The electronics aren't the big mystery they were until not long ago. On another site a guy recently put a 2015 Coyote in to a 10th gen truck like ours. He pulled a 4.6 to put it in. He documented the entire process including splicing the Coyote harnesses in to the existing trucks harnesses. I was always under the belief that the 10th gen trucks limiting factor was the changeover from the SCP communications network to the federally mandated communications networks now required. Nope. He and others have demonstrated that bit of conventional wisdom was just wrong. 4.6 to 5.4 would even have less issues to deal with.
Have you ever done this swap? all I am trying to say is that there are so many small things that must be changed, it would be very frustrating and expensive, and time consuming without a complete donor. throttle brackets, dipstick tubes, both engine and transmission, motor mounts, yes they are different........ exhaust manifolds, intakes, Y pipe, engine harness, ecm, the ignition switch must jive with both the ecm and the gauge cluster or it wont start, these are just some of the things off the top of my head. and this is a swap from same generation trucks, I cant imagine trying to swap in a coyote motor. Yes it can be done but for a guy in his driveway trying to do this **** on the weekends is it really feasible without a complete donor truck???? no in my opinion.
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Old Feb 23, 2020 | 10:42 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by River1
This will probably come across as rude but it's not my intent or meant to be. Don't confuse what you know and can do with what can be done. It wasn't all that long ago, and may still, when going to sites like ebay for engines to swap there were places that specialized in selling, mainly from wrecks, everything related to the engine and electronics from the wrecks to do swaps. The reality is almost all of it is unnecessary. The electronics aren't the big mystery they were until not long ago. On another site a guy recently put a 2015 Coyote in to a 10th gen truck like ours. He pulled a 4.6 to put it in. He documented the entire process including splicing the Coyote harnesses in to the existing trucks harnesses. I was always under the belief that the 10th gen trucks limiting factor was the changeover from the SCP communications network to the federally mandated communications networks now required. Nope. He and others have demonstrated that bit of conventional wisdom was just wrong. 4.6 to 5.4 would even have less issues to deal with.
Yes, but Patman is on a completely different level.
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Old Feb 23, 2020 | 03:17 PM
  #15  
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I've done and been involved in Coyote swaps and have one going on now in a 99 F150. And Yes, I started with the same thoughts as the OP. As you do it you begin to learn. Just go back on this site 10 years and look at what was being said about what could and couldn't be done with PCM's. The OP says above engine mounts are different. No they're not. All modular motors use the same mount pattern on the blocks. Locating the engine might require different mounts by generation or model year but they all fit. Different brackets or whatever can be an issue with any swap. That's just a given and if that stops the swap then not doing it is probably a good idea. What Patman showed so well to everyone is you can run a vehicle with two PCM's or different generations and protocols. A PCM for the engine if needed and the vehicles original PCM to operate the existing systems. They can be spliced together including the old SCP protocol with the newer OBDII protocols. The first time I was involved in a swap the accepted belief was that SCP and OBDII operated at different speeds and frequency and can't communicate. That's true but it's almost entirely related to the engine and that has it's own PCM with the swap. All the voltage related information is accepted just fine. A Coyote's sensor for engine temperature for example can be spliced in to the vehicles original electronics to be read at the instrument panel just fine. Turns out to be exactly one of the benefits of a CAN network. The system looks for, prioritizes, and accepts information as needed by programming. This is an oversimplification but explains how it works. The system isn't discriminate. It will accept almost anything and if properly spliced into the system and will send it where needed.

As I said, there are even books on doing this now to help. I even suggested to Patman to write a book on what he did because of how well he documented what he did. No unnecessary explanations. Just do this, this and this. If anyone can be accused of over thinking things, that's me but this can be done with less concern than most people put in to it. If the OP is using a 5.4 and 4.6 from the same generations, the swap is being way over thought and there are members here better able to explain that than me. The electronics aren't a problem requiring a donor truck. Different vehicles or generations could have issues but nothing that will stop a swap. A swap is work though so don't blindly jump in to one. There are a lot of projects in garages that have never been and never will be finished. And yes, a Coyote swap isn't inexpensive. So? If a inexpensive hobby is what you're after take up day trip hiking. Don't confuse what you can or are willing to do with what can be done. If anyone thinks this is a complicated swap they need to talk with people that have done some Fox Body swaps to understand what complicated really means.

Last edited by River1; Feb 23, 2020 at 03:19 PM.
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