Did complete cam phaser repair, worse than before!
03-12-2013, 10:38 PM
#11
There is more of a chance of one of the phasers being faulty if they are dorman.. Some guys have had issues with dorman replacement phasers and the lockout pin destroying itself.. At a cold start the pin locks the phaser out until its warm.
The other issues you may have are:
Insufficient oil pressure getting to the passenger side head.
A Broken valve spring or cam follower.
A leftover piece of a broken timing chain guide obstructing oil flow through the oil pump pick up in the pan..
A thrust washer on the crank fell out and into the oil pan..
Have you also checked your FPDM for rot? If its not throwing any codes then this could be it too.
The other issues you may have are:
Insufficient oil pressure getting to the passenger side head.
A Broken valve spring or cam follower.
A leftover piece of a broken timing chain guide obstructing oil flow through the oil pump pick up in the pan..
A thrust washer on the crank fell out and into the oil pan..
Have you also checked your FPDM for rot? If its not throwing any codes then this could be it too.
Also, what's your opinion on switching the tensioners? I'm not sure they are in the wrong place (left and right) but I can't guarantee they are in right either. Any idea if they are switched if it would cause the rattle? this is definitely the chain rattling on start up and not a valve noise.
Thanks.
03-12-2013, 10:44 PM
#12
I had the same noise issue. One of my dorman phasers did not lock. Take the oil fill tube out of the valve cover and turn the motor over by hand the phaser should be locked if not you will see the cam stop turning as it comes up on each lobe until the phaser spring winds up. You will have to take out the vct cover to see the drivers side. I replaced my defective phaser using a wedge to hold the chain so I didn't have to take the front cover back off.
Sometimes I have a lash adjuster make a bit of noise on startup but when you have the phaser not lock it sounds like the front of the motor is coming off !
Sometimes I have a lash adjuster make a bit of noise on startup but when you have the phaser not lock it sounds like the front of the motor is coming off !
Thanks
03-16-2013, 12:12 AM
#13
update. looks like the passenger side phaser was not locking. Amazon is sending 2 new phasers and i should get them by Tuesday. Yesterday, the phaser started working properly and now I get no noise on start up! I'm wondering if i should even bother replacing them now.
03-16-2013, 05:19 AM
#14
I would take those new dorman phasers, sell them, and buy some OEM versions.
Your gonna need the timing chain wedge to keep the chains tight on the crank when you pull the valve covers to swap phasers... Unless you can get a buddy to hold the chains up for you while your swapping out the phasers.
03-18-2013, 10:02 PM
#15
Cloyes Tensioners Faulty
Update: Still not right. Went back again and found the Cloyes tensioners are Faulty as well 
When I pulled the tensioners, I found this:
On the factory tensioners, there is a slot on the bottom (relative to the piston) molded into the case, but they leave a thin wall of plastic so that the rubber gasket can't move. On the Cloyes, the slot goes all the way to the gasket, and so when they are tightened, the gasket slides into the slot and leaks.
Be aware of this. If I didn't tear back into the motor, I would have probably damaged the cam bearings due to lack of oil.
When I pulled the tensioners, I found this:
On the factory tensioners, there is a slot on the bottom (relative to the piston) molded into the case, but they leave a thin wall of plastic so that the rubber gasket can't move. On the Cloyes, the slot goes all the way to the gasket, and so when they are tightened, the gasket slides into the slot and leaks.
Be aware of this. If I didn't tear back into the motor, I would have probably damaged the cam bearings due to lack of oil.
03-18-2013, 10:59 PM
#17
Update: Still not right. Went back again and found the Cloyes tensioners are Faulty as well
When I pulled the tensioners, I found this:
Attachment 203871
On the factory tensioners, there is a slot on the bottom (relative to the piston) molded into the case, but they leave a thin wall of plastic so that the rubber gasket can't move. On the Cloyes, the slot goes all the way to the gasket, and so when they are tightened, the gasket slides into the slot and leaks.
Attachment 203870
Be aware of this. If I didn't tear back into the motor, I would have probably damaged the cam bearings due to lack of oil.
When I pulled the tensioners, I found this:
Attachment 203871
On the factory tensioners, there is a slot on the bottom (relative to the piston) molded into the case, but they leave a thin wall of plastic so that the rubber gasket can't move. On the Cloyes, the slot goes all the way to the gasket, and so when they are tightened, the gasket slides into the slot and leaks.
Attachment 203870
Be aware of this. If I didn't tear back into the motor, I would have probably damaged the cam bearings due to lack of oil.
As to your earlier post about the locking pin. I took my old phaser and the defective Dorman apart. My understanding is the pin locks when you shut off your motor and the spring brings the phaser to the full advance position. When the motor starts the VCM solenoid is off so the oil is directed to advance the phaser. This is why if it doesn't lock it will quiet down when the oil pressure comes up as the oil pressure holds the phaser in advance. Under normal operation when the PCM turns on the solenoid to retard the phaser the oil pressure pushes back the locking pin and the phaser is free to move under the oil control of the VCT solenoid. This is just my understanding after messing with this so take it with a grain of salt.
03-19-2013, 09:44 AM
#19
Was that on the side making the noise or were the both like that? That sucks.
As to your earlier post about the locking pin. I took my old phaser and the defective Dorman apart. My understanding is the pin locks when you shut off your motor and the spring brings the phaser to the full advance position. When the motor starts the VCM solenoid is off so the oil is directed to advance the phaser. This is why if it doesn't lock it will quiet down when the oil pressure comes up as the oil pressure holds the phaser in advance. Under normal operation when the PCM turns on the solenoid to retard the phaser the oil pressure pushes back the locking pin and the phaser is free to move under the oil control of the VCT solenoid. This is just my understanding after messing with this so take it with a grain of salt.
As to your earlier post about the locking pin. I took my old phaser and the defective Dorman apart. My understanding is the pin locks when you shut off your motor and the spring brings the phaser to the full advance position. When the motor starts the VCM solenoid is off so the oil is directed to advance the phaser. This is why if it doesn't lock it will quiet down when the oil pressure comes up as the oil pressure holds the phaser in advance. Under normal operation when the PCM turns on the solenoid to retard the phaser the oil pressure pushes back the locking pin and the phaser is free to move under the oil control of the VCT solenoid. This is just my understanding after messing with this so take it with a grain of salt.
Both phasers allow slight movement (couple of degrees) before locking on each compression stroke.
03-19-2013, 09:48 AM
#20
Although it would be tough to over tighten them from the gaskets point of view as the tensioners have steel spacers molded into the case. There is nothing stopping the o ring from migrating into the channel, so even if it held at first with pressure pushing out, I cant see a scenario where it stayed there