2018 B&O Stereo Forscan BREAKTHROUGH
03-19-2018, 12:33 AM
#1
2018 B&O Stereo Forscan BREAKTHROUGH
A lot of you are aware of the Forscan mod for the 2017 and earlier Fords with the Sony stereo. I have discovered, completely by accident, that this mod is possible in the 2018 with B&O stereo as well! This is great news for anyone doing an upgrade because it makes everything so much easier, and I think has more potential for a better sounding system. I'll tell you how I discovered it, and that will help you understand why there is still some work to do on this.
I was doing my upgrade the conventional way, tapping the speaker level outputs to feed into a processor. While i was tapping the tweeter wires, I made a stupid mistake and, with the battery still connected, accidentally shorted the tweeter output wires and fried the ACM (radio/CD unit). A puff of smoke came out of the dash and I almost died :O So I ordered a replacement ACM (which took over a month to get, but that's another story) and installed it myself. I had been told that the ACM needs to be programmed by the dealer before it will work, but I decided to try it out and see if it would just work out of the box, or if maybe I could just program it myself with Forscan.
Long story short, I realized that I was getting a full-range, variable line level signal from the tweeter output of the ACM. The only quirks I have noticed are that the volume is not displayed on the screen, and the Sync voice volume varies with the system volume and so may be much louder than usual. Other than that, the signal is very clean and the system sounds fantastic.
I scanned the ACM with Forscan and found that there are a lot of differences between this one and the original one. I don't know which ones are necessary to make this mod work, but I assume it's not all of them.
Since they system is working the way I want, and I have already fried one ACM, I have decided to leave it alone for now and not make any more changes in Forscan. At least we know the mod is possible, and we can narrow the necessary codes down to a few lines in Forscan. Worst case, you could make all of the changes and it should work. I'm sure someone will do more research and figure out which ones really need to be changed and how to work out the quirks. I have pasted my original Forscan values as well as the ones I am using now. Enjoy!
Original_______________New
7270101 10A0 9200 0173 7270101 0000 0000 0030
7270102 0000 5F03 0093 7270102 0000 0000 0031
7270103 0000 0000 0032 7270103 0000 0000 0032
7270201 7270 2015 5B8C 7270201 7270 2010 0637
7270301 7270 3011 1446 7270301 7270 3011 1446
7270401 0001 0155 53DD 7270401 0000 0000 0033
7270501 0407 2F57 5B20 7270501 0007 2F57 5B1C
7270502 765B 572F 0793 7270502 765B 572F 0793
7270601 0B00 0A00 337D 7270601 0B00 0A00 337D
7270602 0035 005C 00C7 7270602 0035 005C 00C7
7270603 6400 5C00 352C 7270603 6400 5C00 352C
7270604 0033 000A 0075 7270604 0033 000A 0075
7270701 1B00 0A00 338E 7270701 0000 0A00 3373
7270702 0035 005C 00C8 7270702 0035 005C 00C8
7270703 6400 5C00 352D 7270703 6400 5C00 352D
7270704 0033 000A 0076 7270704 0033 000A 0076
7270801 090F 2902 1791 7270801 090F 2902 1791
7270802 1F36 4655 7AA2 7270802 1F36 4655 7AA2
7270803 0217 1F36 40E7 7270803 0217 1F36 40E7
7270804 0E27 4C7C 5B92 7270804 0E27 4C7C 5B92
7270805 400E 274C 0905 7270805 400E 274C 0905
7270806 0F29 4651 5D68 7270806 0F29 4651 5D68
I was doing my upgrade the conventional way, tapping the speaker level outputs to feed into a processor. While i was tapping the tweeter wires, I made a stupid mistake and, with the battery still connected, accidentally shorted the tweeter output wires and fried the ACM (radio/CD unit). A puff of smoke came out of the dash and I almost died :O So I ordered a replacement ACM (which took over a month to get, but that's another story) and installed it myself. I had been told that the ACM needs to be programmed by the dealer before it will work, but I decided to try it out and see if it would just work out of the box, or if maybe I could just program it myself with Forscan.
Long story short, I realized that I was getting a full-range, variable line level signal from the tweeter output of the ACM. The only quirks I have noticed are that the volume is not displayed on the screen, and the Sync voice volume varies with the system volume and so may be much louder than usual. Other than that, the signal is very clean and the system sounds fantastic.
I scanned the ACM with Forscan and found that there are a lot of differences between this one and the original one. I don't know which ones are necessary to make this mod work, but I assume it's not all of them.
Since they system is working the way I want, and I have already fried one ACM, I have decided to leave it alone for now and not make any more changes in Forscan. At least we know the mod is possible, and we can narrow the necessary codes down to a few lines in Forscan. Worst case, you could make all of the changes and it should work. I'm sure someone will do more research and figure out which ones really need to be changed and how to work out the quirks. I have pasted my original Forscan values as well as the ones I am using now. Enjoy!
Original_______________New
7270101 10A0 9200 0173 7270101 0000 0000 0030
7270102 0000 5F03 0093 7270102 0000 0000 0031
7270103 0000 0000 0032 7270103 0000 0000 0032
7270201 7270 2015 5B8C 7270201 7270 2010 0637
7270301 7270 3011 1446 7270301 7270 3011 1446
7270401 0001 0155 53DD 7270401 0000 0000 0033
7270501 0407 2F57 5B20 7270501 0007 2F57 5B1C
7270502 765B 572F 0793 7270502 765B 572F 0793
7270601 0B00 0A00 337D 7270601 0B00 0A00 337D
7270602 0035 005C 00C7 7270602 0035 005C 00C7
7270603 6400 5C00 352C 7270603 6400 5C00 352C
7270604 0033 000A 0075 7270604 0033 000A 0075
7270701 1B00 0A00 338E 7270701 0000 0A00 3373
7270702 0035 005C 00C8 7270702 0035 005C 00C8
7270703 6400 5C00 352D 7270703 6400 5C00 352D
7270704 0033 000A 0076 7270704 0033 000A 0076
7270801 090F 2902 1791 7270801 090F 2902 1791
7270802 1F36 4655 7AA2 7270802 1F36 4655 7AA2
7270803 0217 1F36 40E7 7270803 0217 1F36 40E7
7270804 0E27 4C7C 5B92 7270804 0E27 4C7C 5B92
7270805 400E 274C 0905 7270805 400E 274C 0905
7270806 0F29 4651 5D68 7270806 0F29 4651 5D68
Last edited by Cioffdaddy; 05-20-2018 at 11:33 PM.
03-19-2018, 01:15 AM
#2
Senior Member
Awesome. This is super interesting.
I have already discovered 7270101 is off from what the Forscan SS reports - for example, the same values to disable the Fake Engine Noise apply to disable the front tweeters. And others to, for example, disable speaker fault detection (so you don't have to use load adapters).
Even with my B&O system - which otherwise works well after a lot of work, but no Forscan mods - I've noticed occasional weirdness when, to give another example, adjusting the voice volume and having the system get "stuck" in that mode until I change sources.
This is clearly going to take some work. And I don't want to short out my ACM either
That said, worth investigating for sure!
I have already discovered 7270101 is off from what the Forscan SS reports - for example, the same values to disable the Fake Engine Noise apply to disable the front tweeters. And others to, for example, disable speaker fault detection (so you don't have to use load adapters).
Even with my B&O system - which otherwise works well after a lot of work, but no Forscan mods - I've noticed occasional weirdness when, to give another example, adjusting the voice volume and having the system get "stuck" in that mode until I change sources.
This is clearly going to take some work. And I don't want to short out my ACM either
That said, worth investigating for sure!
03-19-2018, 02:11 PM
#3
Senior Member
I cross-posted this to the Forscan thread who suggested we filter the list, so let's narrow some stuff down....please double-check my work
I put everything in to a spreadsheet so I could sort it out easier.
Right off the bat we can eliminate all but 6 lines because they have the same values for old and new and therefore aren't relevant:
That leaves us with
7270501 & 701 are related to FM/AM presets, at least assuming the ACM hasn't changed that much from the 2017, and can be discarded.
7270401 is, from the Forscan sheet, for region settings. @Ciofdaddy, you probably want to look at this one - Your original ACM value had it configured for a US based system, which I assume is correct, however your new ACM has you set as "undefined". Which I would assume a stock replacement module would have since a Dealer would program it and set the right region. I don't know what problems this may or may not be causing you, but I recommend setting 401 to your old value - per the spreadsheet, it doesn't appear to have changed from the 2017.
I can't find 7270201 in the current Forscan spreadsheet. Let's put a pin in this one because we don't know what it does but could be relevant.
That leaves us with 7270101 & 7270102, which makes sense because those are relevant to the speaker config in the current spreadsheet too.
This is where we really enter the unknown. If we go by the Forscan spreadsheet, the original ACM values you had for 7270201 of 10A0 9200 0173 correspond to:
Ciofdaddy - for your original values, are you sure those were the stock ones? Or are those possibly the values you tried originally when you attempted the changes but before you had to replace the module? If not then something is different for sure.
If we go by your new values for 727-01-01, 0000 0000 0030 we get:
This is probably long enough for one post so let's do 727-01-02 in another.
I put everything in to a spreadsheet so I could sort it out easier.
Right off the bat we can eliminate all but 6 lines because they have the same values for old and new and therefore aren't relevant:
7270103
7270301
7270502
7270601
7270602
7270603
7270604
7270702
7270703
7270704
7270801
7270802
7270803
7270804
7270805
7270806
7270301
7270502
7270601
7270602
7270603
7270604
7270702
7270703
7270704
7270801
7270802
7270803
7270804
7270805
7270806
7270101
7270102
7270201
7270401
7270501
7270701
7270102
7270201
7270401
7270501
7270701
7270401 is, from the Forscan sheet, for region settings. @Ciofdaddy, you probably want to look at this one - Your original ACM value had it configured for a US based system, which I assume is correct, however your new ACM has you set as "undefined". Which I would assume a stock replacement module would have since a Dealer would program it and set the right region. I don't know what problems this may or may not be causing you, but I recommend setting 401 to your old value - per the spreadsheet, it doesn't appear to have changed from the 2017.
I can't find 7270201 in the current Forscan spreadsheet. Let's put a pin in this one because we don't know what it does but could be relevant.
That leaves us with 7270101 & 7270102, which makes sense because those are relevant to the speaker config in the current spreadsheet too.
This is where we really enter the unknown. If we go by the Forscan spreadsheet, the original ACM values you had for 7270201 of 10A0 9200 0173 correspond to:
1=Int SDARS enabled & APIM gen2 & EFP CAN based & APIM available
0=HD radio enabled & DAB not avail & SWC not avail & CGEA 1.3
A=Front: Fixed Line Level & Rear: Fixed L/L
0=Aux1 not used & Aux2 not used
9=Front Det disabled & Rear Det enabled & Antenna Type: Mast & 6 presets
2=FT absent & CS : North American & ANC present & USB absent
0=Mono Subwoofer
0=Internal CD & no conversion
0=CC check for open & AAM absent & non-Convertible & Chimes disabled
xxxx xxxx x*xx < Forscan sheet doesn't list a value of "1" for this option, only 0, 2, 8, and A
And no values listed at all for the last two digits (7 and 3) of the 3rd group.
0=HD radio enabled & DAB not avail & SWC not avail & CGEA 1.3
A=Front: Fixed Line Level & Rear: Fixed L/L
0=Aux1 not used & Aux2 not used
9=Front Det disabled & Rear Det enabled & Antenna Type: Mast & 6 presets
2=FT absent & CS : North American & ANC present & USB absent
0=Mono Subwoofer
0=Internal CD & no conversion
0=CC check for open & AAM absent & non-Convertible & Chimes disabled
xxxx xxxx x*xx < Forscan sheet doesn't list a value of "1" for this option, only 0, 2, 8, and A
And no values listed at all for the last two digits (7 and 3) of the 3rd group.
If we go by your new values for 727-01-01, 0000 0000 0030 we get:
0=Int SDARS enabled & APIM gen2 & EFP CAN based & APIM not available
0=HD radio enabled & DAB not avail & SWC not avail & CGEA 1.3
0=Front: Int Amp & Rear: Int Amp
0=Aux1 not used & Aux2 not used
0=Front & Rear Det enabled & Antenna Type: Mast & 10 presets
0=FT absent & CS : North American & ANC absent & USB absent
0=Mono Subwoofer
0=Internal CD & no conversion
0=CC check for open & AAM absent & non-Convertible & Chimes disabled
0=Demand Lamp disabled & Tune **** Acceleration off
No values listed for last two (3 and 0) of 3rd set
0=HD radio enabled & DAB not avail & SWC not avail & CGEA 1.3
0=Front: Int Amp & Rear: Int Amp
0=Aux1 not used & Aux2 not used
0=Front & Rear Det enabled & Antenna Type: Mast & 10 presets
0=FT absent & CS : North American & ANC absent & USB absent
0=Mono Subwoofer
0=Internal CD & no conversion
0=CC check for open & AAM absent & non-Convertible & Chimes disabled
0=Demand Lamp disabled & Tune **** Acceleration off
No values listed for last two (3 and 0) of 3rd set
Last edited by planetix; 03-19-2018 at 02:14 PM.
03-19-2018, 02:25 PM
#4
Senior Member
727-01-02 is where we get in to EQ and mixing.
Original shown from Ciofdaddy's ACM: 0000 5F03 0093
No listing for the rest, new or old.
I suspect this group + 727-01-01 is where A) the differences in the B&O are and B) related to the changes Ciofdaddy is seeing (or more accurately, hearing).
This is where we need to narrow the efforts I think. There's also 7270201 which isn't listed anywhere and may or may not have anything to do with it.
Next, hopefully later today, I'll pull my current ACM values - I haven't changed them - and compare. Ciofdaddy, it would be super interesting and helpful if you just left 727-01-01 and 727-01-02 with your new values, revert the rest, and see if that changes anything/if you still get line out. Certainly I would fix the regional one (04).
And if that doesn't work change the unknown value, 727-02-01 back to your "new" value as well and see what that does.
Original shown from Ciofdaddy's ACM: 0000 5F03 0093
0=No value listed
0=EQ Selection #0
0=LF: no mixing & CF: no mixing
0=RF: no mixing & Rear: no mixing
No values listed for remaining sets.
0=EQ Selection #0
0=LF: no mixing & CF: no mixing
0=RF: no mixing & Rear: no mixing
No values listed for remaining sets.
I suspect this group + 727-01-01 is where A) the differences in the B&O are and B) related to the changes Ciofdaddy is seeing (or more accurately, hearing).
This is where we need to narrow the efforts I think. There's also 7270201 which isn't listed anywhere and may or may not have anything to do with it.
Next, hopefully later today, I'll pull my current ACM values - I haven't changed them - and compare. Ciofdaddy, it would be super interesting and helpful if you just left 727-01-01 and 727-01-02 with your new values, revert the rest, and see if that changes anything/if you still get line out. Certainly I would fix the regional one (04).
And if that doesn't work change the unknown value, 727-02-01 back to your "new" value as well and see what that does.
03-19-2018, 08:28 PM
#5
Great work planetix! The original ACM values I posted are from before I changed anything in Forscan. Before I replaced the ACM I had tried making the changes from the old mod but it didn’t seem to do anything so I changed them back. I think that the some of the codes may do different things in the 2018 vs 2017, but what you posted is a good starting point.
Also, I realized that the voltage on the outputs when the truck is off comes from the “stereo extended play” setting which is set to 20 min in my truck. The radio is in standby mode and can be turned on even though the truck is off. After 20 min it went away. This setting is in the APIM and can be changed or turned off there. I don’t think it’s related to the ACM mod.
Another quirk I forgot to mention is that the fader and EQ controls are disabled, but I would kinda expect that anyway.
I would bet that that third digit of 7270101 is where we should look.
Also, I realized that the voltage on the outputs when the truck is off comes from the “stereo extended play” setting which is set to 20 min in my truck. The radio is in standby mode and can be turned on even though the truck is off. After 20 min it went away. This setting is in the APIM and can be changed or turned off there. I don’t think it’s related to the ACM mod.
Another quirk I forgot to mention is that the fader and EQ controls are disabled, but I would kinda expect that anyway.
I would bet that that third digit of 7270101 is where we should look.
03-19-2018, 10:17 PM
#6
Senior Member
It's different for sure - I pulled my values and they are the same as your originals which don't line up exactly to the existing Forscan mappings.
For example, with 727-01-01, the second group by default on ours w/B&O is 9200. It's well known because the second digit disables the fake engine noise....on 2017 and under, which have a different default value. If you go by the current Forscan spreadsheet and compare it to what we have with the 2018 B&O, that would result in a set of values that is completely different. So that code is obviously different....but which does which?
Can you try leaving 7270101 & 7270102 where they are, and putting the others that are changed back to OEM? Curious to see if you get your volume indicator back when you set your region correctly (I am betting that one is still accurate, and probably needs to be done - they wouldn't set the region ahead of time on a replacement ACM). Also curious to see what, if anything, 727-02-01 does since that hasn't been mapped.
For example, with 727-01-01, the second group by default on ours w/B&O is 9200. It's well known because the second digit disables the fake engine noise....on 2017 and under, which have a different default value. If you go by the current Forscan spreadsheet and compare it to what we have with the 2018 B&O, that would result in a set of values that is completely different. So that code is obviously different....but which does which?
Can you try leaving 7270101 & 7270102 where they are, and putting the others that are changed back to OEM? Curious to see if you get your volume indicator back when you set your region correctly (I am betting that one is still accurate, and probably needs to be done - they wouldn't set the region ahead of time on a replacement ACM). Also curious to see what, if anything, 727-02-01 does since that hasn't been mapped.
04-17-2018, 09:19 PM
#8
Following
Following as well.
I just picked up my 18 Limited SCrew today and am planning a full audio system and would love to get low level output.
Where red is the amp located in the 18s with b&o??
I just picked up my 18 Limited SCrew today and am planning a full audio system and would love to get low level output.
Where red is the amp located in the 18s with b&o??
04-17-2018, 10:43 PM
#9
Senior Member
Behind the rear driver side passenger seat, next to the sub. No one has really figured out how to get low level from the B&O easily without causing other problems. Your best bet is a decent LOC/DSP combo tapped in to the high level.
04-18-2018, 06:33 AM
#10
Thanks a lot! What do suggest for a good. LOC/DSP then?