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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 07:59 AM
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Default Towing experience

I’ve read a few articles about people towing boats and trailers. And they said their range was significantly lower than advertised. One guy towing a wake board boat said he got 58 miles on a full charge with a platinum. Another stated he got 108 miles towing an airstream. Anyone on here have any more input? Thanks
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 12:20 PM
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I've heard stability wise the Lighting is great, probably due to it being nearly 7000 lbs.

Range does seem to be pretty poor with a trailer, but it also depends on what the trailer is. A low profile utility trailer or something probably does ok, but a big boat or a travel trailer with lots of aero drag is going to kill it. TFLTruck towed a 6000 lb travel trailer with their lightning and almost ran out of juice after only 90 miles. 90 miles wouldnt get me anywhere.

I think part of the issue is that the electric motors are sized to efficiently produce the power needed to move the truck unloaded. When the truck is having to generate a lot of power continuously the motors become inefficient and generate a lot of heat and this results in a loss that is greater than the proportional weight and drag added by the trailer. For example, TFL went from a ~300 mile unloaded range to 90 miles with the trailer, so <1/3 of the unloaded range. A gasoline engine to some degree gets a little more efficient at high load due to the reduction in pumping losses which is why big V8's only get 14 mpg unloaded and 10 mpg towing a trailer. My Ecoboost generally sees towing MPG's >1/2 its unloaded MPG.

The other issue is the Lightning wont be able to regen much with a trailer on the open freeway. When you are towing a big trailer at high speed, there are very few situations where the truck will be able to coast and regen. Any regen that would have helped the unloaded range is most likely not there while towing. Its not like everyone is towing down the Ike Gaunlet everywhere and can regen for 8 miles straight.

Basically, I would say if your goal is to frequently tow >100 miles round trip without a charger, or >200 miles round trip with a charger at the destination, you probably want to skip the Lightning. If its only an occasional tow and you can deal with waiting to charge the truck, then it would probably be fine.

For me, because I tow a travel trailer around UT, CO, WY, and ID, where my shortest trips are at least two hours and can go 6 hours in a day, the Lightning is absolutely not an option. And a lot of the placed I go, there are no options to charge.One of my last trips I towed my trailer 90 miles one way from the last tow into the desert.

Last edited by mass-hole; Sep 13, 2022 at 12:32 PM.
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by mass-hole
I think part of the issue is that the electric motors are sized to efficiently produce the power needed to move the truck unloaded. When the truck is having to generate a lot of power continuously the motors become inefficient and generate a lot of heat and this results in a loss that is greater than the proportional weight and drag added by the trailer. .
So you're close... but it's backwards. An ICE engine is so INEFFICIENT at low loads that it will only get 14-16 mpg unloaded. ICE engines actually increase in overall efficiency when they have higher loads (ever hear the phrase that an engine is most efficient at wide open throttle?)

You see the same with in-town MPG vs. Highway MPG. We are so used to seeing better numbers on the highway that any EV with better numbers in town is weird. It's just because that how terrible inefficient ICE engines are in town.

All of that said, you now notice the ridiculously good efficiency of an EV motor, but they get destroyed by high wind resistance loads... They just don't have the power density of a tank of Gasoline. So yes... it's about constant load showing the true colors of an EV, but it's not due to heat... just due to lack of energy density of the fuel. EVs are just REAAALLLY good a low loads and sipping electrons, which is a stark contrast to the low-load inefficiency of ICE powered vehicles.

SOURCE: ASE Diesel Tech, and EV Trained Tech
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by mass-hole
I've heard stability wise the Lighting is great, probably due to it being nearly 7000 lbs.

Range does seem to be pretty poor with a trailer, but it also depends on what the trailer is. A low profile utility trailer or something probably does ok, but a big boat or a travel trailer with lots of aero drag is going to kill it. TFLTruck towed a 6000 lb travel trailer with their lightning and almost ran out of juice after only 90 miles. 90 miles wouldnt get me anywhere.

I think part of the issue is that the electric motors are sized to efficiently produce the power needed to move the truck unloaded. When the truck is having to generate a lot of power continuously the motors become inefficient and generate a lot of heat and this results in a loss that is greater than the proportional weight and drag added by the trailer. For example, TFL went from a ~300 mile unloaded range to 90 miles with the trailer, so <1/3 of the unloaded range. A gasoline engine to some degree gets a little more efficient at high load due to the reduction in pumping losses which is why big V8's only get 14 mpg unloaded and 10 mpg towing a trailer. My Ecoboost generally sees towing MPG's >1/2 its unloaded MPG.

The other issue is the Lightning wont be able to regen much with a trailer on the open freeway. When you are towing a big trailer at high speed, there are very few situations where the truck will be able to coast and regen. Any regen that would have helped the unloaded range is most likely not there while towing. Its not like everyone is towing down the Ike Gaunlet everywhere and can regen for 8 miles straight.

Basically, I would say if your goal is to frequently tow >100 miles round trip without a charger, or >200 miles round trip with a charger at the destination, you probably want to skip the Lightning. If its only an occasional tow and you can deal with waiting to charge the truck, then it would probably be fine.

For me, because I tow a travel trailer around UT, CO, WY, and ID, where my shortest trips are at least two hours and can go 6 hours in a day, the Lightning is absolutely not an option. And a lot of the placed I go, there are no options to charge.One of my last trips I towed my trailer 90 miles one way from the last tow into the desert.
I just wasn’t expecting it to be that much of a difference. Maybe a 100 miles or so. The lighting won’t be an option for me.
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by kfergiez
So you're close... but it's backwards. An ICE engine is so INEFFICIENT at low loads that it will only get 14-16 mpg unloaded. ICE engines actually increase in overall efficiency when they have higher loads (ever hear the phrase that an engine is most efficient at wide open throttle?)

You see the same with in-town MPG vs. Highway MPG. We are so used to seeing better numbers on the highway that any EV with better numbers in town is weird. It's just because that how terrible inefficient ICE engines are in town.

All of that said, you now notice the ridiculously good efficiency of an EV motor, but they get destroyed by high wind resistance loads... They just don't have the power density of a tank of Gasoline. So yes... it's about constant load showing the true colors of an EV, but it's not due to heat... just due to lack of energy density of the fuel. EVs are just REAAALLLY good a low loads and sipping electrons, which is a stark contrast to the low-load inefficiency of ICE powered vehicles.

SOURCE: ASE Diesel Tech, and EV Trained Tech
Isnt that exactly what I said?

"A gasoline engine to some degree gets a little more efficient at high load due to the reduction in pumping losses which is why big V8's only get 14 mpg unloaded and 10 mpg towing a trailer. My Ecoboost generally sees towing MPG's >1/2 its unloaded MPG."

The only reason this isnt entirely true anymore is because we have small displacement V6's and displacement on demand V8's that keep the pumping losses low at low load.
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 06:34 PM
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Ice vehicles are actually more efficient at city speeds, despite (I'm agreeing with everyone above) ICE engines being less efficient at low loads. It's just that stopping throws away all the energy you used to get up to speed, and idling burns the equivalent of ~12KW of energy. But if you manage to drive steady state 30-40mph, you'll get 30mpg+ in any modern F-150.
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 06:37 PM
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To the OP though: It's becoming very clear that EVs are terrible recreational tow rigs, but might be good for city contractors like me. The only way that'll get fixed is an unpredicted battery breakthrough, charging underway F-Zero style, or programs where you swap your EV for an ICE tow rig on the occasion that you tow.
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Old Sep 13, 2022 | 11:04 PM
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The YoutTube channel Keep Your Daydream borrowed a Lightning once and towed their trailer to a site just for the experience, then hauled it back. They talk about the electricity used for their adventur.
The channel is about the couple who is mostly full time and has a lot of towing experience and always pulls with a Ford, last few trucks have been 250's and one was a 450.
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Old Sep 14, 2022 | 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by 16IngotFX4
The YoutTube channel Keep Your Daydream borrowed a Lightning once and towed their trailer to a site just for the experience, then hauled it back. They talk about the electricity used for their adventur.
The channel is about the couple who is mostly full time and has a lot of towing experience and always pulls with a Ford, last few trucks have been 250's and one was a 450.
The crazy part to me is that, even if you just didnt plug your camper in and hooked a lightning up to the 50A plug at your campsite, it would still take at least 12 hours to fully recharge the truck. So reality is you probably would need a day to recharge the truck while your trailer is hooked up to be able to go do stuff. I don't know about anyone else, but I spend very little time at the campsite. We setup shop and then are out exploring or hiking or whatever and only are at the site when we cook dinner and sleep.
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Old Sep 14, 2022 | 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by mass-hole
The crazy part to me is that, even if you just didnt plug your camper in and hooked a lightning up to the 50A plug at your campsite, it would still take at least 12 hours to fully recharge the truck. So reality is you probably would need a day to recharge the truck while your trailer is hooked up to be able to go do stuff. I don't know about anyone else, but I spend very little time at the campsite. We setup shop and then are out exploring or hiking or whatever and only are at the site when we cook dinner and sleep.
Guess you’ll have to get a class A rig and pull the lightning behind it when you camp haha
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