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17 3.5 Ecoboost Rattle (not trans or IWE)
Here is a video of my 17 3.5 cold start rattle, the noise occurs only in gear or while driving and happens when letting off the throttle. It's coming from both sides of the engine so I'm thinking timing chain. The truck has 5k on it and the noise started about 500 miles ago. It only happens for the 1st 1/2 mile of driving and then it goes away. Anybody else have this issue. I'm gonna get it into Ford just have to make an appointment.
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You should take your truck to the dealer since it is under warranty, There is also a TSB out for timing chain noise (look in the Sticky section).
Why worry about it, Ford will fix it just like they fix all the other annoying little problems we have on the F-150. That what the warranty is for. I can't even count all the warranty issues and TSB's I had done to my last two Fords....at least it was free. |
You mean it's doing that racing up on its own? If so, dealer time.
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Just noticed my 17 does it as well! No idea what it is...
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Originally Posted by iFord
(Post 5566175)
You mean it's doing that racing up on its own? If so, dealer time.
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Happens in neutral and P as well...
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Mine only does it with load on the engine, at least I don't hear mine in neutral. Maybe it' still there just not as loud. It doesn' matter how long I let the truck warm up it will always do it for the 1st half mile or so.
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5566336)
Mine only does it with load on the engine, at least I don't hear mine in neutral. Maybe it' still there just not as loud. It doesn' matter how long I let the truck warm up it will always do it for the 1st half mile or so.
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That sounds really bad!! Cannot wait to hear what they say and find, No freaking way they say that is normal either
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make sure there is nothing in the air filter box other the the air filter.
check the eric belt and tensioner. make sure the is nothing on the belt. make sure the are no stickers pealing away anywhere. if you think it’s internl engine , dealer time. |
Its sounds quite loud by the way... no airbox or belt deal wrong.
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any ideas guys? is it safe to drive?
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Mines been like this for a few months and hasn't gotten worse, ive just been too busy to get into ford. Id do the same if I were you. Prior to making the vid I 5hought it might be the trans pump or iwe but it' defiantly coming from the area of the cam gears both sides.
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I see... any mods? Did you already do an oil change?
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Mine makes same sound...Annoying
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Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5567449)
I see... any mods? Did you already do an oil change?
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5567643)
No oil change yet, all I've done under the hood is an S&B intake.
Ohh and how do you like that intake--I think its the best looking one out there! |
Originally Posted by icecoldak
(Post 5567646)
That has zero to do with the sound--take it to the dealer as that is not right at all!!!!
Ohh and how do you like that intake--I think its the best looking one out there! |
Originally Posted by RRXLTSPORT
(Post 5567475)
Mine makes same sound...Annoying
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I also discovered mine does it ALL THE TIME cold or warm except maybe the first 20 seconds after cold start.
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Oh my, here we go "Rattle Gate"
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My 2017 makes that exact same noise when it is really cold out. I can make it do it in park or drive by letting off the throttle fast. I also have the annoying startup rattle that the deal claims they couldn't find. I would love to hear what your dealer finds! My current plan it to let things break so they can find the issue easier. Haha.
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If it only does it on cold start and goes away once warmed up, it's normal. It's just the waste gates and/or actuators rattling for the turbos. This also happens on BMW's and other turbo'ed vehicles. Some have modded the actuators to remove the slack, but it's really nothing to worry about.
If it does it ALL the time, even when warmed up, then that's another story. |
Originally Posted by BlackBoost
(Post 5569458)
If it only does it on cold start and goes away once warmed up, it's normal. It's just the waste gates and/or actuators rattling for the turbos. This also happens on BMW's and other turbo'ed vehicles. Some have modded the actuators to remove the slack, but it's really nothing to worry about.
If it does it ALL the time, even when warmed up, then that's another story. |
Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5566095)
Here is a video of my 17 3.5 cold start rattle, the noise occurs only in gear or while driving and happens when letting off the throttle. It's coming from both sides of the engine so I'm thinking timing chain. The truck has 5k on it and the noise started about 500 miles ago. It only happens for the 1st 1/2 mile of driving and then it goes away. Anybody else have this issue. I'm gonna get it into Ford just have to make an appointment.
https://youtu.be/YAe8ORhjCiQ Have you taken this to the dealers so they can hear and look at it??? |
Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5569630)
It is not Wastgate rattle, its coming from the top of the engine and only does it cold, I don' hear it coming from the area of the wheel wells.
From the top and only when cold? Sounds like sticky lifters then. Also nothing to be overly concerned about if it goes away when warmed up. |
We listened very closely today... mine does it very loud when cold and much quieter when warm, the noise appears to be coming from the distribution chains like if there is some slack and is more prominent on the passenger side of the block.
If its normal I dont know... my dealer isnt exactly the best so I am waiting for further diagnosis from the forums members. |
Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5569788)
We listened very closely today... mine does it very loud when cold and much quieter when warm, the noise appears to be coming from the distribution chains like if there is some slack and is more prominent on the passenger side of the block.
If its normal I dont know... my dealer isnt exactly the best so I am waiting for further diagnosis from the forums members. You're not going to get a good answer from someone on the internet. If your dealer isn't good, take it somewhere else. You don't have to take it to the dealer you bought it from. |
Originally Posted by BlackBoost
(Post 5570778)
You're not going to get a good answer from someone on the internet. If your dealer isn't good, take it somewhere else. You don't have to take it to the dealer you bought it from.
I did took it to my mechanic... but should be very expensive to fix so warranty is in order... hope someone can take it to the dealer and post their findings... |
Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5571852)
I did took it to my mechanic... but should be very expensive to fix so warranty is in order...
hope someone can take it to the dealer and post their findings... I'm waiting for you to take it in and report back, lol! |
Uhhhhhh this is the second gen 3.5 I assume???
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Originally Posted by dodgehemi0
(Post 5575712)
Uhhhhhh this is the second gen 3.5 I assume???
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5575584)
I'm waiting for you to take it in and report back, lol!
btw could we cause permanent damage to the engine if we continue to drive it this way? |
Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5577390)
LOL... my dealer will never find the issue so you are going to need to help us!
btw could we cause permanent damage to the engine if we continue to drive it this way? |
Originally Posted by RockyMountain
(Post 5578411)
I will let you know if it causes damage. I continue to drive the piss out of mine. My dealer said they could not find anything wrong, so until something falls off, it is game time!
Did they say it was normal? Its crazy loud for me so I think its not normal, let me know if you find anything else... how many miles have you driven with the noise and since when? thanks bud! JC |
Mine has done it since the truck was new. I have put 13,000 miles on it so far. The dealer had it for the entire day to look at the rattle and two other noises. I showed them videos of my noises and even emailed them the videos. They told me that they could not get it to reproduce the noises. They make the noises every time and are very obvious so I am not sure they even looked. Maybe the tech wasn't very good...
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Mine has just started... doesnt sound “cheap” but drivability is unaffected...
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Any updates on this?
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Up to 14,000 miles now. Nothing has exploded or fallen off. It is supposed to be really cold next week so maybe something will happen.
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Originally Posted by RockyMountain
(Post 5587530)
Up to 14,000 miles now. Nothing has exploded or fallen off. It is supposed to be really cold next week so maybe something will happen.
Keep us posted... wondering is this is normal or not. |
Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5589470)
Keep us posted... wondering is this is normal or not. |
So, I had a reply to my YouTube video from another user and they had the same problem diagnosed as failed cam phasors.
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5616714)
So, I had a reply to my YouTube video from another user and they had the same problem diagnosed as failed cam phasors.
Wow, wont that make the engine fail? |
Top end noise rattle? Hmmm that doesn't seem good. Mine definitely doesn't' do that.
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Raptors are having the same problem... one of them even had to replace the whole engine:
http://www.fordraptorforum.com/f261/...n-noise-54715/ http://www.fordraptorforum.com/f261/...acement-54883/ |
My dealer tried to say the noise was normal yesterday, even after sending them this video, I refused to pick up the truck and they are going to check it out again cold this morning.
tried to tell me it was a purge valve making the noise. |
Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5622558)
My dealer tried to say the noise was normal yesterday, even after sending them this video, I refused to pick up the truck and they are going to check it out again cold this morning.
tried to tell me it was a purge valve making the noise. Read the whole thread at the raptor forums... apparently the noise can be fixed with a simple PCM flash update... If problem left on its own it will degrade cam phasers. Ford silent of course... are things getting out of hand for the company? JC |
Dealer acknowledged the noise is not normal, thinks it' bad phasers. Truck goes back the week of the 29th ford authorized a tear down and rental car.
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I thought I had the noise too,It was only when the truck was cold I would notice it when I will remote start it and walk up to with the put the keys in it..Then I heard the npose stop and come back, it was then I realize the noise was the air-conditioning compressor Cycling on and off even though I didn’t have the defrost on in the truck remote starting it must default it to the on position because when I got in the truck and turned the key on the compressor stopped cycling and there was no noise. Engine is quiet and perfect when the compressor is not cycling ... just something to put out there make sure the noise is actually from the engine not an accessory .Personally if my Ford dealer has to tear into the engine, I will be getting rid of the truck I don’t want them touching my engine. If I wanted a rebuilt engine in the truck I would’ve bought something used. I used to work for a dealership, I know who works on these trucks and I know I dont want them inside my engine, I won’t even let them change my oil....just my .02 |
Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5623452)
Dealer acknowledged the noise is not normal, thinks it' bad phasers. Truck goes back the week of the 29th ford authorized a tear down and rental car.
Perhaps you should read the links I posted and try a PCM reflash first....?The guy had his engine rebuilt and even swapped with no solution... |
After reading about the Raptor guys struggle, I am even more convinced that I should just buy the extended warranty and drive my "eco-diesel" until it throws a rod. That guy went through a lot of brain damage! I seem to have every single noise mentioned in any ecoboost rattle forum. In the end, I am not sure I have heard of any engines blowing due to the noises (correct me if I'm wrong), but I really don't want to deal with all of the phone calls and endless trips to the stealership, not to mention dealing with FoMoCo.
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Still no TSB's or PCM reflashes for the 2017 3.5 for rough shifting? And the grinding noise from transmission?
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Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5623683)
Perhaps you should read the links I posted and try a PCM reflash first....?The guy had his engine rebuilt and even swapped with no solution... |
Good thread, My 17 3.5 does the same thing, By the time I drive it to the dealer it is warm and doesn't rattle, I first noticed it in March last year when I bot the truck and it is louder now. I inquired with the dealer but they say they haven't seen this issue before,
I am subscribed to this thread |
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Originally Posted by tcp2
(Post 5625411)
Wastegate rattle?
http://www.f150ecoboost.net/forum/31...ing-chain.html https://www.f150forum.com/f118/any-f...rattle-388486/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Glo6FjjsvYo |
OK guys UPDATE...
Just had PCM and TCM (Engine and Transmission modules) flashed with the latest software. I happily report that the noise is gone and as a bonus the transmission shifts into reverse much much quicker and without any lag, previously shifting to R took quite long to actually engage. Thanks! JC |
Welp, time to go get this done then.
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Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5626915)
OK guys UPDATE...
Just had PCM and TCM (Engine and Transmission modules) flashed with the latest software. I happily report that the noise is gone and as a bonus the transmission shifts into reverse much much quicker and without any lag, previously shifting to R took quite long to actually engage. Thanks! JC |
Ok I had my buddy check my VIN and there is no PCM or TCM updates for mine. It is on the latest.
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Originally Posted by ALLROADING
(Post 5627496)
Any TSB? What was your complaint that they did this?
They agreed and was done immediately. |
Originally Posted by w00t692
(Post 5627523)
Ok I had my buddy check my VIN and there is no PCM or TCM updates for mine. It is on the latest.
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UPDATE... I had the noise very very loud on cold start for the first mile as well and also had the same noise but less noticeable when the truck warmed up...
The PCM update does in indeed fix the noise when the truck is warm but the cold one remains exactly the same... maybe its normal? |
Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5628391)
UPDATE... I had the noise very very loud on cold start for the first mile as well and also had the same noise but less noticeable when the truck warmed up...
The PCM update does in indeed fix the noise when the truck is warm but the cold one remains exactly the same... maybe its normal? If it’s normal than why doesn’t mine do it ? I’ve even had ppl comment and ask if my truck is running after sitting all day it’s very quiet , like I said above make sure the ac compressor isn’t running mine is noisey and it runs quite a bit when remote starting it even if defrost isn’t selected . I may need to get the ac compressor looked at lol it is what I’m worried obout. Also when I changed the oil and went to Castrol Magnatec 5w30 I swear the engine got quieter, especially on cold starts , in reading about the Oil , it’s supposed to coat parts and provide protection, I swear it is a noticeable difference and that Oil isn’t expensive at 19-20.00 per 5 quarts it’s a bargain maybe try it on your next oil change . |
Originally Posted by Johnnyd359
(Post 5628533)
If it’s normal than why doesn’t mine do it ? I’ve even had ppl comment and ask if my truck is running after sitting all day it’s very quiet , like I said above make sure the ac compressor isn’t running mine is noisey and it runs quite a bit when remote starting it even if defrost isn’t selected . I may need to get the ac compressor looked at lol it is what I’m worried obout. Also when I changed the oil and went to Castrol Magnatec 5w30 I swear the engine got quieter, especially on cold starts , in reading about the Oil , it’s supposed to coat parts and provide protection, I swear it is a noticeable difference and that Oil isn’t expensive at 19-20.00 per 5 quarts it’s a bargain maybe try it on your next oil change . Also the rattle on cold start is only noticeable when driving off and after immediately letting of the gas the noise will be reproduced. |
2017 and I never fire up a cold engine and drive off unless it’s abouve 55 or so otherwise I let it run a little .
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Well its just too strange then... specially since it took care of the noise when warm completely...
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Got word back from another Youtuber that replacing the Phasers did not fix the problem.
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5633935)
Got word back from another Youtuber that replacing the Phasers did not fix the problem.
I am also now dealing with a bad APIM module. My nav, bluetooth and touchscreen no longer work. haha This may be my first and last FORD.... |
Mine does this as well. Only when the motor is cold and goes away quickly. Can't reproduce it when stationary.
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Mine doesn't make any noises, i checked and rechecked and double checked. I dunno wtf guys. I'm at 11k miles.
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Originally Posted by w00t692
(Post 5635446)
Mine doesn't make any noises, i checked and rechecked and double checked. I dunno wtf guys. I'm at 11k miles.
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Originally Posted by PARIAH
(Post 5635412)
Mine does this as well. Only when the motor is cold and goes away quickly. Can't reproduce it when stationary.
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Well... regarding the BaldMonkey thread starter video. Seems that mine will make the noise, but not as loud (if the video is a good representation of the volume) My startup rattle (produced with a cold motor by driving and letting up on the gas) is a different noise.
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Originally Posted by RockyMountain
(Post 5635731)
Wanna trade trucks!? That way you get the full experience.
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Hello Guys! Any updates?
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Dropped it off last night
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5641084)
Dropped it off last night
JC |
Not sure if it could be related to this issue, but when I had my truck at the dealer yesterday for a bad APIM, I had them look into a new smell. For some reason my cab smells like natural gas fairly often. Of course they could not find anything, but it seems to be slightly sulfuric exhaust fumes getting into the cab. Has anyone heard of the phaser/rattle issues causing the engine to run in a way that clogs or overloads the catalytic converter and stinking? It also seems like I am getting slightly worse gas milage lately.
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14k on mine and makes the same noise but goes away when warm. My dad has the same engine so I’m going to check his next chance I can.
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Originally Posted by A Guy
(Post 5643951)
14k on mine and makes the same noise but goes away when cold. My dad has the same engine so I’m going to check his next chance I can.
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Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5644615)
You mean when warm?
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Whats up guys? Any update on the fix? |
My truck is at the dealer right now. My cab started stinking really bad like natural gas. I was getting light headed and headaches. I told the dealer I was worried about carbon monoxide and that my engine noises may be related to the bad exhaust smell or whatever the issues may be. They had it all day and never called me, so I assume they are stumped. Hopefully I will find something out tomorrow. At least the APIM module they also replaced is under warranty which means I have a rental for free. |
just got a call from the dealer, new phasers and timing chain tensioners are ordered and going to be replaced. They are trying to have it done by the end of the week.
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Hope that solves the problems.
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Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5652341)
just got a call from the dealer, new phasers and timing chain tensioners are ordered and going to be replaced. They are trying to have it done by the end of the week.
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Just got a call from the dealer. They said the smell is gone and they could not find anything wrong with my engine. Back to driving the ecodiesel I guess.:thumbup:
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Originally Posted by RockyMountain
(Post 5653357)
Just got a call from the dealer. They said the smell is gone and they could not find anything wrong with my engine. Back to driving the ecodiesel I guess.:thumbup:
What was the cause of the smell? Guess the didnt fix the noise? |
Originally Posted by James Cole
(Post 5653405)
What was the cause of the smell? Guess the didnt fix the noise? |
Originally Posted by BaldMonkey22
(Post 5652341)
just got a call from the dealer, new phasers and timing chain tensioners are ordered and going to be replaced. They are trying to have it done by the end of the week.
I just took this video of mine. Even though they looked for 4 days, I guess they deem this rattle normal or can't hear Sh!t. Timing Chain Video |
Originally Posted by RockyMountain
(Post 5658928)
Did you get it back yet? Any update on your noises?
I just took this video of mine. Even though they looked for 4 days, I guess they deem this rattle normal or can't hear Sh!t. Timing Chain Video wow yours sounds bad, haven't gotten mine back yet the are waiting on some seals. But they replaced all phasers and both tensioners. Should have an update mid week. Take your truck back and refuse pick it up till they acknowledge the probblem show them your video too. |
Wow,that’s really bad! No way that’s a normal engine sound...wouldn’t be surprised if you get a wrench on dash for cam/ crank timing out. |
Thanks for the support guys. The dealer and my wife are tired of hearing about my noises. haha
I may try a different dealer. It is still under warranty, but this seems silly. |
Originally Posted by dodgehemi0
(Post 5575712)
Uhhhhhh this is the second gen 3.5 I assume???
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After Ford sold its Mazda stock in 2015 and ended partnership, everything has went downhill. Without Japanese support and technical advise, how do you improve reliability? I'm not optimistic with Ford's future at all, and it will get worse when they move on to quad-turbo Ecoboost next.
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Originally Posted by waltchan
(Post 5659568)
Ford continues to get cam and timing chain issues because the engines are not OHV. All these could be easily avoided if Ford copies Chevrolet. OHV was discontinued after 2008 model year with 4.2L, and I miss it dearly each day.
Those issues can be fixed many guys racing Modular V-8 Engines,2 valve,3valve and 4 valve spinning the crap out of them with no problems!!! Did you hear GM coming out with a 4 Valve DOHC V-8 for the Corvette? |
Hello guys... any updates? |
Hello guys... any updates? |
Just picked it up and it made the noise before I made it out of the parking lot!
it was in for 15 days, and I told them and showed them the problem still existed before I left. They did all phasers and both tensioners as well as cams. The mechanic came out and didn't even know what the sound was, and he was the one working on the truck. Pretty frustrating! |
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