Ron AKA

I am looking at the Palomino Puma 230-FBS. However, if I go with a Ford it will be a 2015 regular cab, long box, 3.30 rear end, and 3.5 L EcoBoost. Have no doubts that with the new aluminum body, this trailer will be well within safe limits. I essentially put nothing in the box of the truck other than the hitch.

http://www.palominorv.com/productinf...3943&RVType=FW

brulaz

Haven't seen the info for the 4x4s, but for 4x2s Autoweek recently leaked the 2015 Max Payloads, Min Curb Weights and GAWRs.

The 2015 RegCab 3.5L EcoB could have a Payload as high as 2580#, even without the HD payload option. Pretty impressive. With HD Payload and 18" wheels you could boost that to 3270#, but that would come with the 3.73 rear e-lock rear diff.

Looks like the rear GAWRs are pretty good for the 4x2s too. Should have a max of 2268# of rear GAW avail with the reg truck, and 2921# with the HD payload, 18" wheels. Lotta room there for pin weight.



The footnotes are:
4 - 2.7L EcoB HD Payload
5 - 5L or 3.5L EcoB HD Payload, 17" steel wheels
6 - as 5 but with 18" Al alloy wheels

brulaz

Off the OP's topic, sorry.
Ron_AKA, one issue with the 2015 RegCab 8' trucks is that they are now 141" wheelbase. Not the old 145". Most people think that 4" has been shaved off the cab leaving little room behind the seats. The 2011-2014s had a fair amount of room back there but that maybe a lot tighter now.

Ron AKA

Yes, I was aware of that. Suspect they did it to save weight and boost the weight reduction of the new model. Thanks for the numbers. I can't see going with a 3.73 rear end with the EcoBoost. The low end torque of the EcoBoost lets you use a more normal ratio and preserve some fuel economy when not towing.

Ron AKA

Yes in comparing the 4x2 regular cab Ecoboost 3.5 specs from 2014 to 2015, it appears the cargo weight allowance has increased from 2060 lbs to 2580 lbs or a cargo increase of 520 lbs. So, not quite the 700 lbs that the aluminum body is supposed to save, but close.

In my case with the Puma 230-FBS trailer and a hitch weight of 1107 lbs that leaves me with 1,473 for passengers, gasoline, the weight of the hitch itself, and any misc cargo etc. So even without the maximum cargo package (which I hope to avoid), that should be lots of capacity. Yes, that is a dry hitch weight, but a 5th wheel trailer normally loads up in a balanced manner without any significant change in dry hitch weight load.

Not at all worried that the truck would be overloaded...

Ron AKA

Was not aware of a TT hitch that moves the pivot point forward. Yes, that should help some. However, the center of gravity of a TT is still going to remain further behind the vehicle and still has more potential to make the overall unit unstable due to sway. A fifth wheel overlaps the tow vehicle and as a result the center of gravity of the trailer is always significantly closer to the truck.

RedOne

Oh, believe me you want that 3.73 back there. It makes the whole truck much more lively to drive...19-23 mpg isn't good enough for you, after all it is a full size pickup truck...you want better fuel mileage than that, go buy a Prius or Volt or hybrid something.

Ron AKA

I already have a Toyota Camry Hybrid. Not a chance I would go with a 3.73 on the EcoBoost, or even the 3.55. The 3.31 will be just fine. You only gain 100 lbs towing capacity going from a 3.31 to a 3.55 (9,700 to 9,800 lbs), and you would have to take the maximum capacity option to even do 3.73. On the other hand the 5.0 L gains 1,400 lbs towing capacity going from the 3.31 to the 3.55. Makes a lot more sense with that engine, but not with the 3.5 EcoBoost. You have paid for the two turbos, so you may as well get something out of them. Peak HP in a truck is rather useless unless you are climbing a real steep hill. What counts is what is at low RPM. That is why the diesels get a good reputation for trailer towing.

RedOne

Whatever...5.0L needs rpms (ie lower gears helps) to make most of its hp and torque. The Ecoboost makes most of it at about 2500rpms so low rpms equal more hp and torque. At 70mph my Ecoboost with 3.73s is at 1750 rpm in 6th. Lugging an engine in low rpms that is not designed for it doesn't save you anything especially gas if that is your thing.

As for pulling with a 5th wheel I think there are more than enough of us pulling 5ers via an F150 with lots of miles on the road that will tell you if you are going to pull, MAX TOW or HD is where it is at and all those come with 3.73s for a reason. While hauling my 5th wheel I rarely have to shift into 5th gear and almost never in 4th while on the highway. Only very steep passes is it ever in 4th and only once did I have to get into 3rd and that was because I was stuck behind a semi.

I'm sure with the 5th wheel Ron AKA is looking at, he will be in 5th or 4th or even 3rd gear at the max every time with 3.31 gears. His truck, he can live with it...not me.

PS. The new 1/2 tons and x-lite 5ers ain't like the old ones either!!!

Ron AKA

The problem is that the high ratio rear end thinking is the result of peaky V-8 non turbo engines which were used in the past for towing. The turbo changes all of that. Yes you do get the best mpg and engine efficiency at lower rpm's, and if you have a turbo the engine does not lug, while a conventional gas engine will lug. The turbo changes the whole game of towing.

Lets consider having 100 HP on tap while pulling a trailer on the highway. The Ecoboost produces that at 1500 rpm. The old 6.2 L produces the same at about 1900 rpm. The 5 L produces 100 HP at about 2300 rpm. The revised 2015 5 L is higher tuned and likely will jump up to 2500 rpm or so to get the same power.

What does that mean for rear end ratios? Lets say the 5 L, which is the weakest of the lot in the low RPM towing range, requires a ratio of 4.11 to do the job. That means a 6.2 L needs a 3.40 ratio to provide the same 100 HP while running at 1900 rpm. The 3.5 EcoBoost only needs a 2.68 ratio to run at 1500 rpm and put out the same 100 HP.

Another way to look at it is to compare the 5L with a 4.11 at 2300 rpm (100 HP) to the other two with actual ratios, and the same highway speed. If you put a 3.55 in the 6.2 L it will run at about 2000 rpm and produce about 110 HP. And last a 3.31 in the EcoBoost will run at 1850 rpm and produce about 140 HP.

That is the new math of turbos...

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jonb...orque.png.html