5.0 V8 vs 3.5 EB for 4500lb tow over mountain passes
05-26-2019, 05:25 PM
#91
We are discussing towing up a grade, where Torque is king, not racing down the highway. Gearing to the torque band is what I'm discussing, and the difference between the 3.5 and the 5.0 is at least 2000 RPM, not 100.
2017 Gen 2, Peak Torque, 470LbFt@ 2250-3500 RPM, 2017 5.0400 LbFt @4500 RPM. Choosing the correct rear gear for the power band helps the transmission select the proper gear for the work, even with the 10 speed. Choose to low a gear then the trans starts hunting. When someone is used to having the engine roaring at 4500 RPM to go up a grade, then they expect the same from an engine that is now outside of it's peak torque and is in too low a transmission gear. Makes all the difference in the world between these two engines.
The 10 speed does negate some of this, but having the correct rear gear still does matter.
2017 Gen 2, Peak Torque, 470LbFt@ 2250-3500 RPM, 2017 5.0400 LbFt @4500 RPM. Choosing the correct rear gear for the power band helps the transmission select the proper gear for the work, even with the 10 speed. Choose to low a gear then the trans starts hunting. When someone is used to having the engine roaring at 4500 RPM to go up a grade, then they expect the same from an engine that is now outside of it's peak torque and is in too low a transmission gear. Makes all the difference in the world between these two engines.
The 10 speed does negate some of this, but having the correct rear gear still does matter.
The 100 RPM highway example was to illustrate just how little the difference in rear end ratios make.
A final point does Ford not put a 4.11 ( or 4 something) in the Raptor. I'm sure they were looking for peak performance. At the expense of fuel economy perhaps.
Last edited by Hoss10; 05-26-2019 at 05:27 PM.
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Nicklaus (05-27-2019)
05-27-2019, 03:32 AM
#93
I'm not really following any of that but what do I know. I'm pretty sure the computer programming will attempt to keep the engine in it's power band when under load. When towing up a mountain my truck will run in the 3000 range which I suspect is near it's peak torque.
The 100 RPM highway example was to illustrate just how little the difference in rear end ratios make.
A final point does Ford not put a 4.11 ( or 4 something) in the Raptor. I'm sure they were looking for peak performance. At the expense of fuel economy perhaps.
The 100 RPM highway example was to illustrate just how little the difference in rear end ratios make.
A final point does Ford not put a 4.11 ( or 4 something) in the Raptor. I'm sure they were looking for peak performance. At the expense of fuel economy perhaps.
05-27-2019, 07:24 AM
#95
I know the Raptor was not made for towing and it has larger wheels etc!
I was referring to the comment that a 3.73 rear end would put the 3.5 EB "out of it's power band" and effect performance.
I guess to sum up. The F150 has a 10 speed transmission and it shifts gears which changes RPM!
To answer the original posters question. I have driven trucks all my life and I'm old (live on a farm) and have towed pretty much everything with many different trucks. Ranging from beefed up 1 ton V8s to an inline 6 with a stick. The 3.5 EB has more towing power then any of them at a much lower RPM, very Diesel like. I didn't say the F 150 is the best towing vehicle I have ever owned because it isn't. But the power is there.
I was referring to the comment that a 3.73 rear end would put the 3.5 EB "out of it's power band" and effect performance.
I guess to sum up. The F150 has a 10 speed transmission and it shifts gears which changes RPM!
To answer the original posters question. I have driven trucks all my life and I'm old (live on a farm) and have towed pretty much everything with many different trucks. Ranging from beefed up 1 ton V8s to an inline 6 with a stick. The 3.5 EB has more towing power then any of them at a much lower RPM, very Diesel like. I didn't say the F 150 is the best towing vehicle I have ever owned because it isn't. But the power is there.
01-13-2022, 09:36 PM
#96
Junior Member
01-13-2022, 10:01 PM
#97
Senior Member
I’m reading this with interest because I currently have 2016 F150 3.5 EB max tow w/ 3.72 gearing and tow a 4800 lb TT without any issues going up long 7%grades in Utah and Colorado. I’m looking at trading my TV for a 2019 F150 3.5 EB that has a reg tow package w/3.33 gear ratio. Any advice?
01-13-2022, 10:31 PM
#98
Senior Member
Not going to get much response by posting in a 2.5 year old thread!
Won't be as quick off the line, but with 10 gears, will have little issue finding a good one for whatever speed you make on the highway. Having a 3.73 rear would tighten the gap between those gears, but not tremendously.
Vs the 2016, both the lower first gear and additional torque are going to take up the slack for the 3.31 diff.
Addendum: Just the 1st gear reduction (12%) takes up the 3.73-3.31 jump (11%).
Last edited by Flamingtaco; 01-13-2022 at 10:37 PM.
01-13-2022, 11:35 PM
#99
Originally Posted by Bobyall;[url=tel:7112953
7112953[/url]]I’m reading this with interest because I currently have 2016 F150 3.5 EB max tow w/ 3.72 gearing and tow a 4800 lb TT without any issues going up long 7%grades in Utah and Colorado. I’m looking at trading my TV for a 2019 F150 3.5 EB that has a reg tow package w/3.33 gear ratio. Any advice?
01-14-2022, 09:46 AM
#100
It's got a 10sp transmission with a higher ratio 1st, and 50lb-ft of additional torque
Won't be as quick off the line, but with 10 gears, will have little issue finding a good one for whatever speed you make on the highway. Having a 3.73 rear would tighten the gap between those gears, but not tremendously.
Vs the 2016, both the lower first gear and additional torque are going to take up the slack for the 3.31 diff.
Addendum: Just the 1st gear reduction (12%) takes up the 3.73-3.31 jump (11%).
Won't be as quick off the line, but with 10 gears, will have little issue finding a good one for whatever speed you make on the highway. Having a 3.73 rear would tighten the gap between those gears, but not tremendously.
Vs the 2016, both the lower first gear and additional torque are going to take up the slack for the 3.31 diff.
Addendum: Just the 1st gear reduction (12%) takes up the 3.73-3.31 jump (11%).
IF it were the 6 speed I would not get it for towing, but the 10 speed will get by OK, I would still prefer 3.55 with the EB for towing
