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3.5L NA torque info. Interesting comparison to 5.0L

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Old 01-03-2019, 06:35 PM
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Default 3.5L NA torque info. Interesting comparison to 5.0L


https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1403003-3-5l-na-torque-curve.html
Do not believe the 3.5L NA is getting enough credit.

Believe it is interesting to compare the 3.5L NA to the 5.0L NA.
The 3.5L NA torque curve is nearly flat in the 2000-3000 rpm range
& peaks at 4250 rpm.
The 5.0L NA torque curve has no flat rpm ranges. The 5.0L NA has a totally positive linear slope torque curve from 1000 rpm to 3850 rpm at peak torque, then decreases with negative slope.

At 65 mph in 6th gear OD with stock tires, the 3.5L NA engine speed is 1814 rpm with default 3.55 rear end ratio. The engine develops 197 lb-ft of SAE net torque, based on the torque curve furnished by TOM and curve fit adjusted to meet the current F150 peak torque specification, 253 lb-ft @ 4250 rpm.

At 65 mph in 6th gear OD with stock tires, the 5.0L NA engine speed is 1692 rpm with default 3.31 rear end ratio. At that engine speed the 5.0L NA develops 173 lb-ft of net torque, 24 lb-ft less than the 3.5L NA.

The 3.5L NA develops 12% more net torque at crusing highway speed
than the 5.0L NA.

Engine speed is easy to calculate.
MPH road speed x 1min/60 sec x tire rotations/mile x trans gear ratio x rear end ratio = engine speed, RPM.
Tire rotations/mile is published by each tire manufactures for size of tire and easy to find on Tire Rack.com for most tires.
Stock tires for the F150 are 245/70/17.

The only experiece of towing a heavy load with a light duty truck was back in 1992
when towed a 26 ft boat with a flybridge & two stern drive engines from SOCAL to Portland, Oregon. Used my 5.8L/C6 , three speed trans in a Ford Bronco as the towing vehicle with 105" wheel base.
The weight of the boat & trailer was approximately 8000#.
Barely made the trip. Used 2nd gear most of the time at 45 mph with engine speed ~ 2785 rpm with 31x10.5x15 tires. On the 10 mile, 8% down grade from CA state line into Medford, Oregon used 1 st gear all the way down the hill
with ground speed < 25 mph.
Travel a 10 mile up hill, 6% grade almost every day. The Semi Trucks will run you off the road, if traveling < 45 mph.

If traveling 45 mph in 3rd gear, 1.52:1 ratio, with a 3.5L NA ,
engine speed ~ 2767 rpm, which is the middle of the torque curve flat rpm range.
The engine develops 214 lb-ft of net torque.

If traveling 45 mph in 3rd gear with a 5.0L NA ,
engine speed ~ 2580 rpm.
The engine develops 245 lb-ft of net torque, only 14.5% more torque than the 3.5L NA.

The 2015/16, 5.0L even with the upgrade to 387 lb-ft peak torque compared to 2012-2014 with 380 lb-ft of peak torque is not the same 5.OL EFI engine found in the 1986-1996 Ford Bronco/F150.
That engine had a completely different torque curve using a compression ratio of 9.0
compared the 10.5 for the current generation.
engine speed, rpm torque , lb-ft
1000 230
1500 250
2000 265
2400 270 peak rating
2500 270
3000 270
4000 240
This data is published by FoMoCo & posted on this forum

OEM Tire size for that vintage was 235/75/15, according to Tire Rack.
At 45 mph road speed the engine speed is 2928 rmp in 2nd gea,r using the C6 , 3 speed trans and OEM 3.73 rear end.

At that engine speed the engine develops 270 lb-ft torque, operating in the flat region of the torque curve, compared to 245 lb-ft for the current 5.0L operating on the slope of the torque curve with both vehicles traveling @ 45 mph ground speed.
The older generation 5.0L developed 10% greater torque than the current 5.0L NA
at low up hill ground speed towing a heavy load.

Bottom line is in my opinion,the 3.5L NA has a better shaped torque curve for a truck application than the current 5.0L NA and even develops more torque than the 5.0L NA at highway speed.

Believe the 3.5L NA has more merit than it is being given and should not be discounted as a viable engine option.
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Last edited by 10sne1; 01-04-2019 at 06:26 AM. Reason: Better info
Old 01-04-2019, 08:46 AM
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This is all a theoretical comparison. You do realize at part throttle neither of those engines is putting out the number quoted correct? A dyno run is usually a WOT run meaning the graph is showing WOT numbers as the truck rolls through the RPM range in a certain gear, usually the highest non OD gear.

My engine monitor has a Torque mode, it reads a PID that monitors the torque at transmission input I think. Obviously it is a calculated number by the ECU. It does however give an idea of what the engine is putting out at given RPMs. My 6.7 SD(860lb at 1600 RPM per Ford), puts out in the 1600 to 1800 rpm range about 350 to 450 lbs at part throttle. It peaks well over its rated at WOT under load hitting 975 sometimes.
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Old 01-04-2019, 09:43 AM
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I owned a 2015 3.5na for 42 months. For me and the weight I was pulling it was fine. My boat weighs ~3,000lb, add in about 500lb of other stuff in the bed for out of town tournaments, and I was averaging about 13.7mpg. It did take some RPM to get it going from a stop or up a long grade. For the time I owned it I was very happy with it. Highway driving unloaded gave me great gas mileage!
Old 01-04-2019, 11:39 AM
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You don't cruise at WOT so the numbers are irrelevant. Also once at speed you won't use all of the rated power anyways.
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Old 01-04-2019, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by duck9191
You don't cruise at WOT so the numbers are irrelevant. Also once at speed you won't use all of the rated power anyways.
this. Until you know what power the engine makes under cruise conditions, light throttle, etc., comparing the two powerbands based solely on WOT is humorous and trivial.
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Old 01-04-2019, 09:10 PM
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All I can say is I've towed a 784 IH tractor on a 2200 lb trailer. Total wt is around 9000 lbs. with a 2011 F-150 4wd screw with a 5.0 and 3.55 gears. I have a friend who bought a 2013 F-150 regular cab 2wd longbed with a N/A 3.5 and 3.55 gears and his strains to pull a small trailer and a Farmall Cub total wt of 35 to 4000 lbs. What looks good on paper doesn't always work in the real world.
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Old 01-04-2019, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by farmall856
All I can say is I've towed a 784 IH tractor on a 2200 lb trailer. Total wt is around 9000 lbs. with a 2011 F-150 4wd screw with a 5.0 and 3.55 gears. I have a friend who bought a 2013 F-150 regular cab 2wd longbed with a N/A 3.5 and 3.55 gears and his strains to pull a small trailer and a Farmall Cub total wt of 35 to 4000 lbs. What looks good on paper doesn't always work in the real world.
They didn't offer a 3.5na in 2013.
Old 01-04-2019, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by wadekaminski
They didn't offer a 3.5na in 2013.
no but the 3.7 made more hp(20) and torque (25ft lbs) than the 3.5
Old 01-04-2019, 11:11 PM
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2 different motors and as you said you didn't own a 3.5na. I found the 3.5 to work just fine in the real world. I owned one, you didn't.

Ever see 28.9mpg cruising down the Highway in your 5.0? I did in my 3.5na.
Old 01-05-2019, 04:36 AM
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Originally Posted by wadekaminski
2 different motors and as you said you didn't own a 3.5na. I found the 3.5 to work just fine in the real world. I owned one, you didn't.

Ever see 28.9mpg cruising down the Highway in your 5.0? I did in my 3.5na.

I wasnt ******* the 3.5, simply pointing out the engine the poster was likely referring to in his post about towing. I have pulled with and driven multiple NA 3.5 motors. A great little engine no doubt and probably one of the most reliable ford has put out in many years. My best MPG with my 5.0 was 24 at 60mph on flat ground in a 4x4. We got consistent 24 with a flex 2wd at 70 to 75 in my parents 2009 and they still do their 2016. So you must have an exceptional one to get 28 average in a F150 or you were going 50mph. I would never sell a f150 that averaged 28.9 highway.


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