Hello all,

New to the forum, hope this works. I have a 1999 F-150 4x4 with 4.6lt V8. I have been having problems with two key compontents and they both started giving me problems after a recent clutch replacement. Heres what happened.

Clutch finally went out back in aug last year and I figured no problem it was time for that to happen (165k miles). Went to the on base mechanic (I am in the navy) and paid them to install the OEM ford clutch I received from my uncle. They had no problem other than my master cylender needed replacement, which they did. Vehicle was great for 2 to 2 1/2 months then went down hill really fast. I started having starting problems where it sounded like it wasn't catching teeth on the starter/flywheel. Changed starter, after two days of no problems I thought all was well and took it offroading, played in the sand for about 20 mins and my clutch spewed white smoke and my starter would not engage with the flywheel again. Clutch presses down normally, slight friction, and lets me turn starter over with key. Luckly had a friend with big enough truck (F350 V10 dually)to pull me out and now it has been sitting since January. Been doing little things here and there to try and resolve the problem(s). Dont know where to turn next.
What I have checked and or replaced:
~clutch/master cylender fluid, never lost a drop
~starter, replaced, old one wasn't torn up on gears. new one checks good on starter bench
~flywheel, teeth near starter not damaged
~starter relay on firewall, replaced.

when I turn my key it sounds as if the starter is turning but not engaging the flywheel. I dont want to keep doing it and burn out my starter but dont know where else to turn.

Any help would be great, I am soo lost to what to check next.
Sorry for any spelling errors, never was any good in english.
Naked without my truck,
Donnie G

 

Remove the starter and bench test it your self to see if the bendix is engaging. From your description of symptoms and diognosing, I feel you have a better than average understanding of the fundamentals. Am thinking with the off road fun, dirt and grit is preventing the bendix from engaging. Your 1999, probably has the later verson of ford starters which needs to have the small terminal excited or powered to make it work. Question or rather a wish, sure hope you purchased a Ford dealer remanufactured or Ford new. Have absolutely no use for auto parts aftermarket crap.

 

Agreed, test the starter. Who replaced the starter? How many bolts did you have holding it on. Should be three.... How were the wires leading to the starter. Any corrosion?
The white smoke from the clutch is not normal. They tend to slip so you won't damage the transmission but not enough to smoke. If you had gotten oil or grease on it it would still be slipping.
As a side note, was the pilot bearing replaced with the clutch job? Did you get a new release bearing? Was the flywheel machined? Ground flat not turned on a lathe. If it was turned on a lathe that could explain the smoke. Most aftermarket clutch disks come with a slight coating of grease and you are not to add any extra to the input shaft but it needs to be cleaned and inspected for burs. Not sure about OEM.

.

 

I personally did not bench start the starter, I did however stand over the (I am actually ashamed to say) autoz*** employee while he bench tested the starter. It checked out fine, in their test bench. I know just enough mechanicly to get where I am but not to much electronicly to get any further.
I have never bench tested a starter before, will it (should it) actuate both the turning and the engaging with the same 12v charge?
If so, do I connect the "jumper" wire to both the large and small connecter at the same time.
Should the large one rotate and the small one "engage" or is it a simotanius connection only that makes it actuate.
I tried to "rig" it myself with short understanding of electronic knowlage. I had only a set of jumper cables (the type to jump a vehicle {large clamps}) for testing, while it was still installed I conected the cable to the large node on the starter and the ones on the fire wall relay "box" when I conected the cable to the lower node it turned the starter, but did not engage my flywheel. When conected to the other one it did nothing. I then attached the cable to my smaller node (not 100 percent sure it didn't touch the larger node {large clamps remember}) on the starter. It instead turned the starter from the lower node on the relay box. However it once again turned my starter without engaging the flywheel.
I have a buddy of mine that has said something about a "start nuetural switch" i believe that not to be the problem because of the key turning th starter but i am also grasping at straws here.
any help is really appreciated.
I am working alone in an auto hobby shop that is slightly less than adequet because the military doesn't want people working in their own garadges.
any help is really appreciated.

 

Believe you to be doing it correctly. Just in case, this is how I would test it. Starter is removed from vehicle and laying on floor next to battery. Connect the red jumper cable from battery positive to the large terminal of starter. A small wire should connect this large terminal to the small terminal. Connect the black cable to battery negative and other end to starter frame. Hold starter securely as the torque will make it jump. Electrically what happens is this, the small terminal becomes an electro magnet and will pull in the bendix. It also acts like a relay and closes contacts for the large cable to power up the actual motor. I am thinking everything is working, either the bendix has failed and is slipping or it just plain isn't being pulled in.

 

OK,
diddn't wanna come back with out finding out what the problem was, had a friend of mine take a look at the truck, the starter wasn't the problem, it ended up being a problem with the "gear ring" my flywheel and gear ring have become seperated and the starter is turning the gear ring but not the flywheel and hence the engine not cranking over. fun stuff. but thank you bill and Jean for your insight and hopefully if anyone else is reading this because it happened to them, maybe this is something you can look into.

 

Thanks for posting back what it was. Very rare occurrence in these trucks.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

 

Not trying to be a smart butt, its more commonly call ring gear. If this is an auto trans you need to by a new flywheel, comes welded to it. If its a manual trans, the ring gear can be replaced with out buying the heavy and expensive flywheel. If Ford won't sell it seperately, check with auto parts and have them press it on. If you have a torch it can be heated thus expanding it and it will fall into place. Leave it cool and good to go.

 

FWIW I would recommend a new flywheel. They are about $60.00 and have a warranty. No need to machine it and your old / new clutch will bolt right up. Regardless of which way you go I would however inspect the old flywheel and the clutch to determine if it was in any way damaged.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

 

If my write up from the garage that Replaceded my clutch wrote that they "resurfaced flywheel" should that be something they would have, should have, noticed?