@williamb82 - I apologize for my lame responsiveness to your recent PM requesting help. Life got so complicated some time ago that there has been no time to keep up with any social media - then the big one hit me! But I've read through your posts and will comment best I can. Hope it provides some measure of help.

First I am extremely concerned by reading about your moving the chain around [so many teeth this way and so many back 'that way']. Due to the mathematical fact of 'least multiples' (42 teeth on Cam gear, 21 teeth on Crank gear, and 122 chain links), the chain marks 'WALK' around each engine revolution - and will not align perfectly again for 122 revolutions of the engine, or 61 revs to line up on Exhaust Stroke. "IF YOU GET CHAINS MIXED UP on phaser sprocket - there is no way to re-time the cam chains other than removing the timing cover. And a 'trigger' signal for a reliable o'scope test is next to impossible to come by.

The above is exacerbated by 'not clearly understanding' the readings presented by the code reader - and I don't understand yours either. Which is DUMB anyway. NO OBD READER worth it's salt should refer to 'ADVANCE'. There is NO such thing as advance on the 5.4L - only RETARD, in 'crankshaft degrees'. The PCM calculates a number of degrees it 'desires' for each cam independently (generally should be - but doesn't HAVE to be - same for both cams). That is ONE of the OBDII parameters presented for code readers to retrieve. Then the PCM reads the Actual CAM position (based on position of the phaser fingers), ASSUMING the phaser is NOT FOOBARRED. The PCM presents this reading as CAM ERROR, either positive or negative (in crankshaft degrees). //// What your code reader is doing with these numbers is a mystery to me - but there is NO such thing as 342º -anything other than a calculation error- unless that should be negative 18º retarded (which would be 18º over-advanced from the "DESIRED RETARD" ///. This is what you will get if a phaser will NOT UNLOCK and move to retarded position on command due to an internal failure. { If PCM commands 10º Retard, and the phaser stays at base, it is viewed as being 'over advanced' by 10º}

Having said all that - I would beseach you to read and re-read my earlier posts of this thread - and trust what the PCM is telling you. It is RIGHT NEXT TO the problem - just like an o'scope. P0345 is reporting that:: 'During cranking (and only during cranking), when the missing tooth on the tone ring passes the CKP sensor - (TDC cyl 1), it's just a matter of counting tone ring teeth to determine exactly when it should 'LOOK & 'SEE' the proper phaser 'finger' pass the CMP sensor. If it DOES NOT see it - the PCM reports P0345 with the DUMB description of "circuit problem". During cranking - (no oil pressure yet), the phaser SHOULD be locked at base ( 0º ) retard. P0345 can be 'caused' by many things, including bad circuitry within the PCM or wiring continuity. B_U_T, after it 'starts, you report rough idle. THAT ROUGH IDLE IS NOT due to a CMP circuit problem. ALSO, after 'start', the PCM failing to 'see' the phaser finger within margin of time (zero to about 32-34 Cam degrees), it is reported as P0349. You don't report having that, so when Oil Pressure comes up, it MUST be shoving that phaser,,,,,, _mostly_ ,,,,, toward 'base' postion --- but not all the way or you wouldn't have the codes . Therefore, most logically (cam position effects breathing, thus compression - and thus poor power balance, gives you rough idle.


At this juncture, ----- I think EITHER, you have a Ford OEM phaser that is internally Foobarred. OR possibly poor / insufficient oil pressure/flow in bank 2 cylinder head galleys (possibly from cam bearings / lash adjusters, or clogged passageways) that is NOT sufficient to push phaser back to base retard position once it's unlocked for retard. If it is NOT at BASE when you shut the engine down - there is NO OIL PRESSURE on startup to position it correctly during cranking (thus P0345). PLUS, without insult or malice, " I " do not trust the cam / chain timing marks on bank 2 due to paragraph 1 above.

ALSO - hollowed out CATS will _NOT_ cause lean condition. ONLY catalytic converter efficiency CODEs 420 or 430.
ALSO - 'Reverse' / or 'Drive' has nothing to do with PCM commanding Cam 'Retard'. RPM > 800, and Engine LOAD > 25% causes positive some degree of retard based on calculated need for EGR. This condition can be created by Break torquing in 2nd gear.

Hope this helps

 

I know the cam is timed correctly. Anytime I moved it a tooth 1 way or another I made a silver sharpie mark on the chain. However, before I did the timing job 3k miles ago, I lined the crank up on tdc and marked the actual camshaft and #1 cam cap. When I put the crank at tdc, this mark is perfectly lined up, just as it was after the timing job. Based on what you just said, and what I have been thinking, is that even though this phaser only has 3k miles on it, somehow it is damaged internally. Would explain why it runs better at 3krpm than idle. Maybe the low oil pressure condition caused the lock pin to break?

At this point, it is the only thing left I can think of. But I put an old phaser back on that had no codes when removed, with the same exact result, though as long as it sat, maybe the old oil dried and made the varnish worse so it isnt moving like it should? Also, whether the cam gear was advanced or retarded from its current position, the max advsnce was insanely high for that bank, but when watching live data, it is just a split second blip here or there. It makes no sense at all. Ive also verified it is not an oil blockage. I ran it with the vct removed and it flushed tons of oil out of the port, and while I had the phaser off I used compressed air to verify flow from the front of the cam to the cam cap, and vct ports. I guess I need to bite the bullet for a new Ford phaser again. Cold oil pressure is about 90psi. Fully warmed up its 50psi.

So looks like it isnt locking at full advance like it should (code p0345), or holding the timing the ecu is commanding(code p0021)

 

what I have been lead to believe is that p0345 only happens during startup, and that p0021 happens during normal vct operation, but they both indicate the same thing otherwise? timing out of expected range...

I guess you are using the cheese wedge tool when you are moving the chain back and forth on the phaser? because it sounds like you are confident of the chain to phaser relationship, but what about the chain to crank mark relationship?

To add tangential, but possibly useful info: I have a phaser on bank1 that is old and the internal locking pin gets stuck in the unlocked position after at hot idle and doesn't lock the phaser at base timing until next time the engine is cold.. I can watch the error on that side get stuck at ~15 degrees, but it never throws any timing codes, so it makes me wonder what the threshold is before the timing codes pop up? makes me think you've got something funky going on more than just a sticking locking pin....

 

Yes I have the cheese wedge tool, but as mentioned,when I set the crank to tdc, the marks I made on the cam and cam cap line up. I made these marks before I ever did the initial timing job 3k miles ago, and checked them after and they still lined up, and are lined up now as well. The vct is good. No codes on bank 1 when I moved it over there, so at this point it has to be the phaser, though it sucks since it is so new. 2 year warranty from Ford, but I have no faith they will honor it. Been rebuilding engines for 30 years. This is the only vehicle I have ever owned that has been this much of a pita. Likely the last Ford I ever buy. If I can get it fixed, I think im gonna sell it and buy something else.

 

Well, I took the old phaser apart. Messed up and pulled the long bolt out that holds tension on the spring. That worked in my favor as it let me test it. It does lock in the full advanced position like it should. So I sprayed it all out with brake clean. Used steel wire to pull the spring around and put the long bolt back in it to hold the spring in the proper spot, then put blue loctite on the bolts and tqed them to 145in lbs like the lockout instructions say. I never had this phaser timed on the chain correctly so going to try this one before I buy a new phaser. If it works, hell yeah. If not, no loss.

At minimum it should solve code p0345 and idle smooth. And if it moves like its supposed to then code p0021 should no longer occur either. My fingers are crossed. Likely wont get to it until tomorrow though.

 

I just swapped the old phaser back on and made sure the cam timing marks lined up like before. Cleared codes and started it. Runs a lil better but still the exact same codes. I did notice the knock sensor readings were more even this time. Im going to just rip the timing cover off and verify with absolute certainty that the cam timing is correct on bank 2 before buying any more parts.

 

---- O R ?? Another possibility. _IF_ the chain timing has the Bank 2 phaser too far clockwise, I believe you would have the identical symptoms ---EVEN with the Bank 2 phaser functioning properly. Important consideration!! The CMP Sensor ___ IS NOT ___ an 'interrupt' driven computer signal. (Take a look at a wiring diagram and you will find that there are several shared sensors on that circuit). The PCM 'polls' that sensor at the right instant (crank angle) expecting to see the proper phaser finger pass the sensor. P0345 reports it was NOT there when it should have been "during cranking". That is 'mostly' a test of the locking pin as far as I can determine. BECAUSE, once the engine starts up and oil pressure comes up - the VCT is in closed state sending ALL oil flow into advance chambers of phaser and should SHOVE it to base position if it wasn't already so. And timing codes are set as a result of PCM 'calling' for retard and NOT getting proper result.

However, if phaser is a tooth 'forward' (advanced), the result would be the SAME --- EVEN if it is properly locked. (I do not know how wide the window of tolerance is - but one tooth on Phaser tooth is 8.5º, and one on the Crank is ~18º. If I were designing the system, I would consider EITHER to be beyond reasonable tolerance. (BTW, NOTE. While I do not understand the numbers on your scanner, I do not that Bank two shows ADVANCED by about 18º when RPMs are up where the PCM can be calling for retard. And if the cam was at +18º when supposed to be at base, you would have the following BIZARRE operation.
a.) When the PCM is not calling for retard (at idle), the valves are not synchronized between bank1 and 2 and thus poor power balance giving rough idle.
b.)The PCM is able to modulate VCT's independently --- but only within phasers minimum / maximum range (about 32-35 camshaft degrees). SO when PCM is calling for mild retard, (light load just above 25%, and RPMs slightly above 800), it could get bank 1 and bank 2 cams pretty well in sync and smooth out. (I think you have reported this condition.) With the 18º positive offset, ONCE THE PCM calls for retard (BUT NOT UNTIL), the independently modulated bank 2 VCT would be able to retard the cam properly between 0º and 15º (32 to 35 minus 18).
c.) However, when the PCM commanded > 15 degrees retard (mostly light cruise driving condition), the cam would not be 'mechanically able' to retard the cam beyond 15º --- thus 18º "over advanced" (P0021). //Cam timing codes are generated 'WHEN' cams is >5º "+" or "-" from commanded position for > 5 seconds. - to answer @needsmoarturbo 's question/// AND they are 'sticky'!!. (Once detected, they STICK until there are two run cycles without the condition re-occurring.

 

Well, from what you say, it sounds like the cam is 1 tooth advanced. It started out in this ordeal 1 tooth retarded from its current position and gave the same codes and still ran horribly. I am going to pull the front cover and retime that camwith the marks on the chain so there can be no doubt it is correct. I have tried it up to 1 tooth advanced from where it is now,and 3 teeth retarded from where it is now. It always gives code p0345.

 

It occurred to me after hitting the enter key ------ that _IF_ the theory I was exploring last night be correct, It should be able to be confirmed by monitoring the VCT 1 an VCT 2 Solenoid signals, which are ZERO percent when no retard is being commanded, and they indicate the percent "pulse width modulation" being applied to achieve retard equal to "Desired Retard" by achieving CamErr1 and CamErr2 both equal to Zero (which should all be readings presented on your code reader).. If the theory is correct, CamErr2 should be greater than CamError1.
ALSO, I forgot to mention (and it is important in diagnosing this specific issue ---- Watch VCT Enable signal (If we can figure which indicates it), because when any Cam Timing Code occurs, VCT ENABLE is "disabled", and the PCM doesn't attempt retard again during that RUN CYCLE. It's like the PCM says "Screw it, I can't make it work anyway!".

Good Luck

 

Found the problem with the truck. Looks like when I changed the cam and gear on bank 1, I installed it 180deg out. Fixed that and putting it all back together now. Doh!