Limited Slip in the front
12-03-2017, 08:52 PM
#31
FORD lifer
Thread Starter
12-03-2017, 09:00 PM
#32
FORD lifer
Thread Starter
It could be an option at low speeds but many of us run highway speeds in the snow and a spool, or any other locker is dangerous at speed on slippery surfaces. Truly the best set up is an open diff with the option of locking. LSDiffs are a compromise at best but will give you better traction. The problem is, you can not control when or where it decides to give you more traction. In the snow or mud on an off camber surface LSD or lockers can cause you to slide sideways where an open diff will track better as one wheel stays at road speed.
For extreme stuff locked is best. For general road use LSDiffs and lockers sound cool but rarely are an improvement over 4x4 and traction control. Letting the TC brake the spinning wheel has the exact same effect as letting the differential do it and in most case is more effective since it can brake one side to a stop if need be. I have owned and wheeled lots of rigs with full lockers. One of the most impressive though was open front and rear with sophisticated traction control, I liked that a LOT better than the Power Wagon I had.
Just be careful what you wish for.
For extreme stuff locked is best. For general road use LSDiffs and lockers sound cool but rarely are an improvement over 4x4 and traction control. Letting the TC brake the spinning wheel has the exact same effect as letting the differential do it and in most case is more effective since it can brake one side to a stop if need be. I have owned and wheeled lots of rigs with full lockers. One of the most impressive though was open front and rear with sophisticated traction control, I liked that a LOT better than the Power Wagon I had.
Just be careful what you wish for.
I have a PJ 5' x 10' dump trailer, tandem axle, and I used it a lot rebuilding after a flood. I hauled probably 80 loads one year. Before I got the True Trac, I'd be pulling it on gravel, loaded, 7000 lb total, and taking off I got one-wheel peels, lots of flashing TC lights, abs noise, etc. and it would pull it.
After the True trac install, it took off much quicker, zero one-wheel peel, and no flashing lights, which is why I wonder if the front has the same TC as the rear, and if it does, why didn't it sense both back wheels spinning faster than the front.?
01-26-2018, 10:51 AM
#34
Senior Member
[QUOTE=montanaman;5252726]Typically from the factory (at least years ago) if you had a 3.55 rear end, you had a 3.54 front end. The ratios were slightly different. This difference either makes up for a slight difference in output shaft difference front vs rear OR is engineered on purpose to slightly pull in the front (faster spin less power) when in mud, sand snow, etc etc. 4wd is really only for ragged surfaces anyway. I saw YEARS ago when I was like 16 or 17 years old in a 4wheel and off road mag where someone had a Chevrolet with a 4.11 rear and 4.10 front. I asked dad about that and said hey wouldn't that just tear the drivetrain apart. He said. I doubt it. Probably did it to slightly pull in the front because it would only be used in mud or ragged surfaces anyway. Made sense to me at the time.
Figured you did it right, I read elsewhere where someone put different gears front and rear...and Mayhem ensued.
01-26-2018, 11:04 AM
#35
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^^Seems I remember reading the same, in "OffRoad" magazine. That was back in the '70's, so things might have changed? I almost think that was on Jeeps.
Since that was back then, the author may have been smoking something that was very popular back then.
Since that was back then, the author may have been smoking something that was very popular back then.
01-26-2018, 11:27 AM
#36
Senior Member
[QUOTE=dhonnoll;5636644]
When Ford was running the 9"/D44 combo (70s to early 80s that I know of), the it was common to have 3.50 in the rear and 3.54 in the front from the factory. And when they switched to the 8.8"/D44, they had 3.55/3.54s. My CJ is running 4.11 gears in the rear and 4.09 in the front. It's not for any specific performance reason, but the 4.09s were original Spicer gears and in very good shape, and came with the axle and I had already built the rear with the 4.11s
I've already been told/read that as long as the front and rear are within 1%, then they are fine. The theory is there is enough play in the R&P and Tcase gears to account for the slight difference.
Typically from the factory (at least years ago) if you had a 3.55 rear end, you had a 3.54 front end. The ratios were slightly different. This difference either makes up for a slight difference in output shaft difference front vs rear OR is engineered on purpose to slightly pull in the front (faster spin less power) when in mud, sand snow, etc etc. 4wd is really only for ragged surfaces anyway. I saw YEARS ago when I was like 16 or 17 years old in a 4wheel and off road mag where someone had a Chevrolet with a 4.11 rear and 4.10 front. I asked dad about that and said hey wouldn't that just tear the drivetrain apart. He said. I doubt it. Probably did it to slightly pull in the front because it would only be used in mud or ragged surfaces anyway. Made sense to me at the time.
I've already been told/read that as long as the front and rear are within 1%, then they are fine. The theory is there is enough play in the R&P and Tcase gears to account for the slight difference.
01-26-2018, 11:34 AM
#37
FORD lifer
Thread Starter
I remember those discussions years ago, about the front being just a fraction of a percent faster than the rear to keep these thing pointed straight, but I believe it to be a myth, because FOMOCO says you can shift on the fly at any speed now.
*Update: We had a lot of packed snow and ice this winter, and having the front locker is awesome, traction-wise, but with studded snow tires, and the front locker engaged, my mileage kind of sucks - 13.3 mpg driving to work and back.
In the summer, with the Hankook tires It'll always do 17 mpg on that run.
I'm not complaining though - it was a expensive, but great mod.
*Update: We had a lot of packed snow and ice this winter, and having the front locker is awesome, traction-wise, but with studded snow tires, and the front locker engaged, my mileage kind of sucks - 13.3 mpg driving to work and back.
In the summer, with the Hankook tires It'll always do 17 mpg on that run.
I'm not complaining though - it was a expensive, but great mod.
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johnday in BFE (01-26-2018)
01-26-2018, 06:28 PM
#38
USCG MKC
If I remember right the front was always faster to keep it from bucking like a bronco... better for the front to drag the rear just a bit to prevent it and keep it going straight.
03-05-2018, 11:54 PM
#39
Senior Member
Want this setup SO BAD. Really I want rear elocker too. I am tempted to see if I can't get an e-locker and just drill a hole in my housing and run the wires. It's really just 12V DC probably low amps I DOUBT 30. Would be interested to know though Hmmmmmm.
03-08-2018, 02:02 AM
#40
Senior Member
The more I think about it and try to hunt down a Torsen front diff for a Raptor, the more I am considering going instead with a regular oem 8.8 limited slip front diff. I mean its still 31 spline, it should still bolt right in. IT DOESN'T SNOW IN NORTH MISSISSIPPI EXCEPT 1 or 2 times a year. I don't plan on using 4wd on road only off road. I had a 1993 F-150 I put a Dana 44 limited slip in the front of it. It was FINE. the only thing was don't put it in 4wd on dry pavement and expect it to turn, it would jerk the steering wheel out of your hand on dry pavement trying to hard turn. But 4wd wasn't made for that. ESPECIALLY if you have LS in both axles. It just seems like it would work fine for an off road application which is all I would use 4wd for anyway.