2011+ 55-60mph 5.0 Shuddering and EcoBoost Engine Miss/Loss of Power - Possible Fixes
04-30-2012, 06:53 AM
#1261
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Originally Posted by medic75
Never really looked into Nissans. I did consider a Tundra until I looked at the gas mileage. On top of that, I still don't think either can hold up to a Ford or Dodge - even with the current F150 problems.
So far I think the 3.5L EcoBoost is a good engine and a great concept. I think the problem is too many people at Ford pushing it to be ready before it was. I honestly think Ford is looking for a fix, but I am not sure that it will ever trickle down to those of us who discovered this problem for them. I am pretty sure that if this is any major cost to repair, we are all screwed. Just image how may F150s are out there with this problem right now and multiply that by a $2000 or more fix. Kinda like the cost of changing out the toyota frames ....... not cheap.
04-30-2012, 08:08 AM
#1262
Haulin Bass!
The Ecoboost is ready, is good, does exactly what it should, and delivered on it's promises. Mine is awesome.
However, it does use just as much fuel or a bit more when there is a resistance load as the V8's, makes sense as it takes fuel to make power to haul.
The sad part is seeing so many of you here having these issues when I don't and if it was an issue with all our trucks mine would show it as I drive in all those conditions that seem to cause issues. I keep waiting for a big disappointment when something shows up but 22,000kms later mine is still awesome.
I feel bad for anyone not getting a good experience from the best truck out there today.
Ford needs to figure this out and give you what you bought.
However, it does use just as much fuel or a bit more when there is a resistance load as the V8's, makes sense as it takes fuel to make power to haul.
The sad part is seeing so many of you here having these issues when I don't and if it was an issue with all our trucks mine would show it as I drive in all those conditions that seem to cause issues. I keep waiting for a big disappointment when something shows up but 22,000kms later mine is still awesome.
I feel bad for anyone not getting a good experience from the best truck out there today.
Ford needs to figure this out and give you what you bought.
I keep telling people with the issue to lemon out their trucks. Ford doesn't want a mass of Lemon vehicles on the market. The more people that lemon the more they're going to work on making it right or giving you a good deal outside of court to make it right.
04-30-2012, 12:14 PM
#1263
Senior Member
Well, mine's at the dealer now, and for the second time. I sent a very lengthy email to the dealer/service shop director as well as one of the dealers owners. This morning droping it off, I had their master mechanic, regional Ford Mo. Co. Engineer and the Service Director listening to me explain my issues etc. BTW, look at older post a few pages back if you want more on my issues, but much of the same..knocking, shudder etc.
I spent about an hour or so with them and they all agreed like bobble heads to address the issues.
The master mechanic basically came back out as I was leaving and said their going to do as much as they can to dianose the issues, but that Ford has their hands tied most of the time and will not authorize work unless it's something they feel is a problem. Indicating that it almost takes recall volume of complaints to get anything done.
He expressed frustration with it...he seemed genuine anyway. For all you EB folks, he did say they are having huge issues and they are getting pissed at Ford for not letting them fix the issues. I have the 5.0 ...no turbo(s) to deal with!! Not one but two! EKK!
So...we'll see what happens...
Can you say PINTO??????
I spent about an hour or so with them and they all agreed like bobble heads to address the issues.
The master mechanic basically came back out as I was leaving and said their going to do as much as they can to dianose the issues, but that Ford has their hands tied most of the time and will not authorize work unless it's something they feel is a problem. Indicating that it almost takes recall volume of complaints to get anything done.
He expressed frustration with it...he seemed genuine anyway. For all you EB folks, he did say they are having huge issues and they are getting pissed at Ford for not letting them fix the issues. I have the 5.0 ...no turbo(s) to deal with!! Not one but two! EKK!
So...we'll see what happens...
Can you say PINTO??????
04-30-2012, 12:25 PM
#1264
Stevo the fish killer
shudder issue
From what I have read this shudder issue seems to be only in EB and 5.0 model trucks, not the 3.7l. Is that correct?
Thinking of buying a 2012 3.7 SCAB 4X4 later this year.
Thanks
Thinking of buying a 2012 3.7 SCAB 4X4 later this year.
Thanks
04-30-2012, 02:25 PM
#1265
Senior Member
My wife would be so proud of my admission!
04-30-2012, 09:58 PM
#1266
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Listening to everyone's problems (and mine) with these new F150's Ithought of the following idea (I originally posted this under the Database sticky - but now think it belongs here.
HERE IS THE SOLUTION - Someone needs to make thier own commercial - much like the one Ford has where they surprise a new Ford customer with reporters and all - asking them how they like their new ride, their Ford touch etc. and cameras clicking away.
I am sure you have all seen this commercial. Just this time - someone who is handy with media should stage a pretend commercial - asking a NEW Ford truck owner the following questions:
- how do you like the shudder
- how did you react when the tranny started to leak
- is it true you can't even feel the NEW F150 tranny shift gears? HA!
- how do you like the fact that FORD DOES NOT PAINT THE UNDERSIDE OF THE DOORS - YES IT IS TRUE, CHECK IT OUT!!!!!! LOOK RIGHT UNDER THE DOOR AND ALONG THE BOTTOM OF THE SILL - THIS OF COURSE WAS FREE OF CHARGE
- HOW DO YOU LIKE THE BUMP BUMP BUMP IN THE STEERING
- Isn't SYNC great - don't you find it easy to use - HA! HA! HA!
- WOULD YOU LET YOUR FRIENDS DRIVE YOUR TRUCK - sure they can keep it
- What do you love most about your truck - .......silence!
AND THEN POST THE COMMERCIAL ON YOUTUBE! Much like the guy who had his guitar broken on American Airlines and wrote a song along with a video and posted it on youtube. This got everyone talking. I believe David Letterman even had him on his show.
Ford has cut too many corners - they now decided in 2012 that they need to save $100 a truck buy no longer including door sill protectors on the 2012. They cut them out on the rear doors on the 2011 , and SUPRISE no one complained -soooo no more door sill protectors on the 2012 - FRONT OR BACK DOORS.
COME ON FORD! I LOVE THE TRUCK - BUT GET IT RIGHT!!!!! YOU ARE CUTTING WAY TOO MANY CORNERS - SMARTEN UP! DO THE RIGHT THING AND FIX THESE TRUCKS! I can truly see you loosing market share - your pissing off too many loyal customers. I really thought Ford learned their lesson from past mistakes. At least that's what their CEO said in an interview when they were talking about how they survived the auto recession. Wait - he wouldn't lie would he??????I say Bul#$%^ - they just cut corners and that's how they did it!
HERE IS THE SOLUTION - Someone needs to make thier own commercial - much like the one Ford has where they surprise a new Ford customer with reporters and all - asking them how they like their new ride, their Ford touch etc. and cameras clicking away.
I am sure you have all seen this commercial. Just this time - someone who is handy with media should stage a pretend commercial - asking a NEW Ford truck owner the following questions:
- how do you like the shudder
- how did you react when the tranny started to leak
- is it true you can't even feel the NEW F150 tranny shift gears? HA!
- how do you like the fact that FORD DOES NOT PAINT THE UNDERSIDE OF THE DOORS - YES IT IS TRUE, CHECK IT OUT!!!!!! LOOK RIGHT UNDER THE DOOR AND ALONG THE BOTTOM OF THE SILL - THIS OF COURSE WAS FREE OF CHARGE
- HOW DO YOU LIKE THE BUMP BUMP BUMP IN THE STEERING
- Isn't SYNC great - don't you find it easy to use - HA! HA! HA!
- WOULD YOU LET YOUR FRIENDS DRIVE YOUR TRUCK - sure they can keep it
- What do you love most about your truck - .......silence!
AND THEN POST THE COMMERCIAL ON YOUTUBE! Much like the guy who had his guitar broken on American Airlines and wrote a song along with a video and posted it on youtube. This got everyone talking. I believe David Letterman even had him on his show.
Ford has cut too many corners - they now decided in 2012 that they need to save $100 a truck buy no longer including door sill protectors on the 2012. They cut them out on the rear doors on the 2011 , and SUPRISE no one complained -soooo no more door sill protectors on the 2012 - FRONT OR BACK DOORS.
COME ON FORD! I LOVE THE TRUCK - BUT GET IT RIGHT!!!!! YOU ARE CUTTING WAY TOO MANY CORNERS - SMARTEN UP! DO THE RIGHT THING AND FIX THESE TRUCKS! I can truly see you loosing market share - your pissing off too many loyal customers. I really thought Ford learned their lesson from past mistakes. At least that's what their CEO said in an interview when they were talking about how they survived the auto recession. Wait - he wouldn't lie would he??????I say Bul#$%^ - they just cut corners and that's how they did it!
05-01-2012, 09:53 AM
#1267
I like the idea.....not sure if there are any "legal" issues with doing this, but like the idea. Post the video link on Ford's FB page. Everyone here could post it on their FB page and other social media sites, ask their friends to do the same....call it an "experiment with the power of social media". Even w/o a commercial, just pointing more people back to this thread wold be a step in the right direction.
05-02-2012, 12:22 PM
#1268
Member
I haven't read the whole thread, but I thought I'd share some feedback on the 'shudder' issue.
On the last trip I did I kept my Torque app on for a while and watched the boost, load, fuel rate and AFRs in various load conditions.
One thing I noticed was that the boost fluctuates a lot at light load and ~1500rpm, seeing it jump around from 2 to 4psi when the load remained steady. This is exactly the load area at 55 - 65mph, which people describe as the 'shudder' issue. I don't think it's driveline shudder at all, but simply poor wastegate control at light loads and low rpm. I think it's just a sort of 'sweet spot' where the turbo not really spooled up yet (not enough exhaust flow yet) and there is enough load that the computer is trying to get some boost. It seems like it really should kick down to 6th at a slightly lower load. But maybe the engineers were trying to avoid the constant shifting that would result, and maybe also take advantage of a slight mpg improvement.
On the last trip I did I kept my Torque app on for a while and watched the boost, load, fuel rate and AFRs in various load conditions.
One thing I noticed was that the boost fluctuates a lot at light load and ~1500rpm, seeing it jump around from 2 to 4psi when the load remained steady. This is exactly the load area at 55 - 65mph, which people describe as the 'shudder' issue. I don't think it's driveline shudder at all, but simply poor wastegate control at light loads and low rpm. I think it's just a sort of 'sweet spot' where the turbo not really spooled up yet (not enough exhaust flow yet) and there is enough load that the computer is trying to get some boost. It seems like it really should kick down to 6th at a slightly lower load. But maybe the engineers were trying to avoid the constant shifting that would result, and maybe also take advantage of a slight mpg improvement.
05-02-2012, 12:30 PM
#1269
I haven't read the whole thread, but I thought I'd share some feedback on the 'shudder' issue.
On the last trip I did I kept my Torque app on for a while and watched the boost, load, fuel rate and AFRs in various load conditions.
One thing I noticed was that the boost fluctuates a lot at light load and ~1500rpm, seeing it jump around from 2 to 4psi when the load remained steady. This is exactly the load area at 55 - 65mph, which people describe as the 'shudder' issue. I don't think it's driveline shudder at all, but simply poor wastegate control at light loads and low rpm. I think it's just a sort of 'sweet spot' where the turbo not really spooled up yet (not enough exhaust flow yet) and there is enough load that the computer is trying to get some boost. It seems like it really should kick down to 6th at a slightly lower load. But maybe the engineers were trying to avoid the constant shifting that would result, and maybe also take advantage of a slight mpg improvement.
On the last trip I did I kept my Torque app on for a while and watched the boost, load, fuel rate and AFRs in various load conditions.
One thing I noticed was that the boost fluctuates a lot at light load and ~1500rpm, seeing it jump around from 2 to 4psi when the load remained steady. This is exactly the load area at 55 - 65mph, which people describe as the 'shudder' issue. I don't think it's driveline shudder at all, but simply poor wastegate control at light loads and low rpm. I think it's just a sort of 'sweet spot' where the turbo not really spooled up yet (not enough exhaust flow yet) and there is enough load that the computer is trying to get some boost. It seems like it really should kick down to 6th at a slightly lower load. But maybe the engineers were trying to avoid the constant shifting that would result, and maybe also take advantage of a slight mpg improvement.
05-02-2012, 12:58 PM
#1270
Member
To me, and IMHO, that is Part II of the Condensation issue; that is, water droplets trapped in the vacuum hoses that are affecting engine controls. Most likely the solenoid control valve for the turbos. The ECU does not know what to do with bad readings it gets from engine controls.
When going through Oregon I had the exact same problem posted here... I was going ~55mph, and tried to get around someone in traffic and stepped on the gas. Rapid misfires and no power, lots of shudder. It threw the following codes:
P0300 - multiple misfire
P0304 - misfire cyl #4
P0305 - misfire cyl #5
P0306 - misfire cyl #6
I backed off, cruised for maybe 1/2mile, then tried accelerating again... no problems, and it hasn't happened again since.
The codes were there for the day, then gone the next day when I went to the dealer. They simply stated that the coils must have gotten wet, and implied that it was normal/expected. It was raining for the entire trip, and I was driving for probably an hour before this occurred. It wasn't like I was fording a river though, just decent rain showers on the highway. I have driven in much worse rain with other vehicles and never had a problem like this...
I was cruising at light load (55 - 60mph) for maybe 30 minutes prior to this occurring, so little boost. When I tried to step out and pass was probably the most boost I had gotten to that day, and I had changed lanes at the same as stepping on the throttle, and that's when the problem happened.
I am now scared to try to step on it to pass now, not knowing if the problem may occur again. If I really needed the power at that moment to get out of trouble, I would have been screwed...
I can't see where the coils are under the hood. I haven't taken the engine cover off, but I assume they are coil-on-plug? If so, I can't see how I went through enough water to temporarily kill all coils on one side of the engine.
I would have thought if the water was 'ingested' it would have caused misfires on possibly both banks, maybe even in the same pattern as the firing order, not a whole side of the engine.
Last edited by sholland96; 05-02-2012 at 01:02 PM.