Flex Fuel / E85
10-29-2017, 06:34 PM
#21
Senior Member
Found this thread while searching. I was talking to a guy from Atlanta last week and a NACS fuel show I was attending in Chicago. He was telling me how he runs E85 in all his Ford trucks, even some older mid 90s trucks in his fleet. He was obviously very pro-ethanol from talking with him. I was telling him how I don't run E85 in my flex fuel F-150 because I've always read you need to change oil more often. I currently run Amsoil full synthetic and change at 10k intervals which is twice a year at minimum. He claims it BS put out by oil companies that E85 requires more frequent oil change.
So I'm wondering what all your thoughts are on the oil change interval with E85 question? I have a hot E85 tune on my programmer that I could load but never have. E85 around here in the corn belt is generally at least $0.50 cheaper than regular so it might be better overall on cost and it's easy to find. I just don't want to dirty up my expensive synthetic oil too early!
I'm taking a trip next week to Minnesota so it would give me about 1000 miles round trip to test the E85.
So I'm wondering what all your thoughts are on the oil change interval with E85 question? I have a hot E85 tune on my programmer that I could load but never have. E85 around here in the corn belt is generally at least $0.50 cheaper than regular so it might be better overall on cost and it's easy to find. I just don't want to dirty up my expensive synthetic oil too early!
I'm taking a trip next week to Minnesota so it would give me about 1000 miles round trip to test the E85.
10-30-2017, 08:22 AM
#22
Senior Member
If you normally run 87/89 gas, chances are pretty good you won't see any cost savings.
Now, if you a run a 93 tune, you will. The price difference between E85 and 93 here by me can vary as much as $1 plus. I'd lose some mileage on the E85, but I figured as long as the price difference was .70 a gallon or more, it would be E85. Anything less, and I'd run 93. The 5.0 certainly had more power with the E85. I lost around 3mpg or more on E85.
Now, if you a run a 93 tune, you will. The price difference between E85 and 93 here by me can vary as much as $1 plus. I'd lose some mileage on the E85, but I figured as long as the price difference was .70 a gallon or more, it would be E85. Anything less, and I'd run 93. The 5.0 certainly had more power with the E85. I lost around 3mpg or more on E85.
Yep, over the past month, E85 has been $0.70/gallon less than 87 octane here, and $1.30/gallon less than 93 octane. So it's a no-brainer. More horsepower, less money.
I have played around with it more this year and I typically see a loss of 3 MPGs with E85.
On the factory ECU tune, E85 produces 15 horsepower/10 lbs. ft. of torque over 87 octane according to published info. from Ford. But with custom tuning you can see as much as 50 horsepower gain on E85.
The only drawback I've ever found personally is that on below freezing mornings the truck can be a little harder to start. Much of that depends on how your local refinery is blending the stuff.
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johnday in BFE (10-30-2017)
10-30-2017, 10:12 AM
#23
14 King Ranch Black
Thanks for the replies. I'm expecting more power with E85, my concern is dirtying the oil.
I emailed Amsoil to get their opinion. My truck gets 98% long distance highway miles and I change the oil every 10k although Amsoil claims it will go longer. We'll see what they come back with.
I emailed Amsoil to get their opinion. My truck gets 98% long distance highway miles and I change the oil every 10k although Amsoil claims it will go longer. We'll see what they come back with.
10-30-2017, 11:00 AM
#24
Renaissance Honky
Spong: with e85 I bet you'll see 14mpg on the highway. That's what I got with the '07 on the Denver trip.
Flex-Fuel economy depends entirely on fuel cost in your area. Where I am (Twin cities) 87 is about $2.45 and e85 at Minnoco is $1.89/gallon. Any time I've run e85, it's saved me about $.01/mile. Not much savings, but over 60,000 miles it pays for a set of tires.
The big savings for me is in running e30, $1.95/gallon. I don't lose any mileage over our mandatory 87 e10, and it's quite a bit cheaper. Right now it's saving me about 20% on my fuel bill. I'm taking that as a tax refund, since MN just LUUURRRRVVVVSSS subsidizing our corn farmers. There may/may not be a power increase in running the e30, maybe the computer is smart enough to realize it's about 93 octane and can turn up the power a bit.
Whatever, I'm using this pig to commute 50 mi/day, and my fuel cost-per-mile is down below 12¢. I'd have to be getting 21mpg+ on 87 to do that, and there's no way it's going to happen with this crap MN e10.
Flex-Fuel economy depends entirely on fuel cost in your area. Where I am (Twin cities) 87 is about $2.45 and e85 at Minnoco is $1.89/gallon. Any time I've run e85, it's saved me about $.01/mile. Not much savings, but over 60,000 miles it pays for a set of tires.
The big savings for me is in running e30, $1.95/gallon. I don't lose any mileage over our mandatory 87 e10, and it's quite a bit cheaper. Right now it's saving me about 20% on my fuel bill. I'm taking that as a tax refund, since MN just LUUURRRRVVVVSSS subsidizing our corn farmers. There may/may not be a power increase in running the e30, maybe the computer is smart enough to realize it's about 93 octane and can turn up the power a bit.
Whatever, I'm using this pig to commute 50 mi/day, and my fuel cost-per-mile is down below 12¢. I'd have to be getting 21mpg+ on 87 to do that, and there's no way it's going to happen with this crap MN e10.
10-30-2017, 11:12 AM
#25
14 King Ranch Black
Spong: with e85 I bet you'll see 14mpg on the highway. That's what I got with the '07 on the Denver trip.
Flex-Fuel economy depends entirely on fuel cost in your area. Where I am (Twin cities) 87 is about $2.45 and e85 at Minnoco is $1.89/gallon. Any time I've run e85, it's saved me about $.01/mile. Not much savings, but over 60,000 miles it pays for a set of tires.
The big savings for me is in running e30, $1.95/gallon. I don't lose any mileage over our mandatory 87 e10, and it's quite a bit cheaper. Right now it's saving me about 20% on my fuel bill. I'm taking that as a tax refund, since MN just LUUURRRRVVVVSSS subsidizing our corn farmers. There may/may not be a power increase in running the e30, maybe the computer is smart enough to realize it's about 93 octane and can turn up the power a bit.
Whatever, I'm using this pig to commute 50 mi/day, and my fuel cost-per-mile is down below 12¢. I'd have to be getting 21mpg+ on 87 to do that, and there's no way it's going to happen with this crap MN e10.
Flex-Fuel economy depends entirely on fuel cost in your area. Where I am (Twin cities) 87 is about $2.45 and e85 at Minnoco is $1.89/gallon. Any time I've run e85, it's saved me about $.01/mile. Not much savings, but over 60,000 miles it pays for a set of tires.
The big savings for me is in running e30, $1.95/gallon. I don't lose any mileage over our mandatory 87 e10, and it's quite a bit cheaper. Right now it's saving me about 20% on my fuel bill. I'm taking that as a tax refund, since MN just LUUURRRRVVVVSSS subsidizing our corn farmers. There may/may not be a power increase in running the e30, maybe the computer is smart enough to realize it's about 93 octane and can turn up the power a bit.
Whatever, I'm using this pig to commute 50 mi/day, and my fuel cost-per-mile is down below 12¢. I'd have to be getting 21mpg+ on 87 to do that, and there's no way it's going to happen with this crap MN e10.
Thanks for the info. I'm only getting about 16-18 on the interstate now as it is (3.73 gears & depending on winds) so 14 isn't a huge deal if I'm getting better performance (running my E85 tune).
I do also have a 91 octane tune I can run. If the E30 is the same octane as premium, I'll have to load that tune and give it a try!
10-30-2017, 01:10 PM
#26
Senior Member
If you want my opinion, stay away from corn fuel. Even if the vehicles are ''flexfuel'', ethanol is still proven to gum up the fuel system & rust fuel cells.
It's all about the lobby.
It's all about the lobby.
10-30-2017, 02:14 PM
#27
Renaissance Honky
I'm going to agree with you on that, turning food into fuel is freakhogging stupid. But, my taxes are already paying for it, so I'm going to take the discount fuel I'm paying for anyways. guh... 
Spong: There's an Oak Ridge National Lab .pdf floating around out there, where they did some tests on various fuels, including a splash-blend e30. They started with 87 octane e0 and ended up at about 94.5 octane. I figure in MN they're starting with 85 octane e0 and adding 2 points of octane per 10% of ethanol added. Figure somewhere between 92.5 and 95 octane on the e30. close enough to work with a 93 octane tune, there's enough adjustment room on the fuel maps for the computer to sort it out.
Spong: There's an Oak Ridge National Lab .pdf floating around out there, where they did some tests on various fuels, including a splash-blend e30. They started with 87 octane e0 and ended up at about 94.5 octane. I figure in MN they're starting with 85 octane e0 and adding 2 points of octane per 10% of ethanol added. Figure somewhere between 92.5 and 95 octane on the e30. close enough to work with a 93 octane tune, there's enough adjustment room on the fuel maps for the computer to sort it out.
Last edited by Eric Kleven; 10-30-2017 at 02:16 PM.
10-30-2017, 02:24 PM
#28
When I first got my truck I ran several tanks of each, figured out the mileage and determined that I needed to have a $0.50 difference just to break even. In my area it's usually about $0.40. So not worth it.
One brand of stores does offer E15 which is generally $0.10 cheaper. However they tend to be more expensive overall to begin with so I buy at a different store.
My family owns a feed mill so I'm tied in with corn pretty tightly. Not a fan of ethanol. It raises the price of corn, which raises the cost of nearly everything. You would be surprised at the many uses of corn. Magazine covers are glossy because of a corn product. Also ethanol is very expensive to produce. The only reason it's cheaper that standard gas is because the government subsidizes it. After using diesel to plant, and harvest, chemicals to protect the crop and water used for production it pollutes just as much as regular gas.
As for more power I just have to laugh. A 5.0 produces around 350 hp but how many actually use that 350? virtually no one. And if you get an extra 10-20 hp are you really going to notice? Unless you are hauling or towing a large load you won't. The butt dyno will say you can but we all know it's a case of believing because you want to believe. So basically your throwing away money for "increased performance" that really isn't there.
One brand of stores does offer E15 which is generally $0.10 cheaper. However they tend to be more expensive overall to begin with so I buy at a different store.
My family owns a feed mill so I'm tied in with corn pretty tightly. Not a fan of ethanol. It raises the price of corn, which raises the cost of nearly everything. You would be surprised at the many uses of corn. Magazine covers are glossy because of a corn product. Also ethanol is very expensive to produce. The only reason it's cheaper that standard gas is because the government subsidizes it. After using diesel to plant, and harvest, chemicals to protect the crop and water used for production it pollutes just as much as regular gas.
As for more power I just have to laugh. A 5.0 produces around 350 hp but how many actually use that 350? virtually no one. And if you get an extra 10-20 hp are you really going to notice? Unless you are hauling or towing a large load you won't. The butt dyno will say you can but we all know it's a case of believing because you want to believe. So basically your throwing away money for "increased performance" that really isn't there.
10-30-2017, 05:09 PM
#29
