mikeinatlanta

Have an odd question. First a little background.
Getting ready to order a new 4X4 extended cab short bed. One thing on my new truck that is non negotiable is a hidden winch up front. The intercooler location on the EB motor interferes with installing a hidden winch so that issue pretty much mandates a 5.0 which is fine with me except that you can't get max tow with the 5.0. I would buy the EB motor in order to get max tow if there was any way to install a hidden winch. The aftermarket hidden winches mount the fairlead in the bumper hole normally closed in the 5.0 and open on the EB.

Question. I remember way back when the EB first came out that some aftermarket intercooler manufacturers were mounting their intercoolers much higher than stock. Do any of the aftermarket intercooler manufacturers currently mount up high enough that I may be able to fit a hidden winch down low?

Let's please not get into a 5.0 vs EB debate. This is all about getting the heaviest suspension components and fitting a hidden winch. If I could have anything I wanted it would be the EB, max tow, and winch, but the winch is priority.
Thanks

chimmike

I do not believe there are any relocation options available yet for the gen2 3.5 ecoboost.

I would recommend getting measurements and ordering a custom core intercooler from Treadstone, fabbing custom piping. It's not difficult, just requires some time and diligence.

w00t692

Full race is working on their relocation kit as we speak. It won't be long before it's out and i'm pretty sure it moves it out the way enough.

mikeinatlanta

Thanks for the info. Had a discussion with Ford and they are saying flatly that moving the intercooler will result in a complete powertrain and emmisions warranty void. Even with no tune or any other changes, they will flatly void. Service Manager says latest from Ford is they are even voiding for a simple cat-back exhaust. Well aware of Magnuson-Moss and not wanting a debate here. Fact is that none of us have the resources to win the fight if they choose to void warranty. Looks like I'm back to a 5.0 for my hidden winch.
FYI, Full Race says their CAC doesn't void warrant, but are unwilling to take up the fight on my behalf if Ford voids.

chimmike

Well...they can't unilaterally void the warranty without proving the change caused an issue to occur...so...they can say whatever they want to say but proving is totally separate.

I will say blocking the intercooler in any way is worse than relocating it.

mikeinatlanta

While I agree in theory, the reality is that they can do whatever they want until you take them to court and win. It's a good lesson on the value of negotiating from a strong position being more important than being morally or technically correct. While I'm the type to go after them in court if needed, I'm also the type to look for a way to avoid the conflict from the beginning. Just my opinion, but I think it's best to avoid this fight if at all possible.

An even better example is lowering. Ford sells a 1.5-2.5 lowering kit for the 4X4. It is simply a rebranded aftermarket product. Ford will void warranty for the aftermarket kit but not with their kit, and with their kit it must be installed by an ASE mechanic (no matter how big and idiot he may be). This is as clear a violation of Magnussen-Moss as you can get, so is it better to pay the $50 extra for the Ford kit and avoid the fight?

With the intercooler, my service manager contends that it cools better and is more efficient (true) and will therefore increase power. It will require removing the louvers which is an emissions system (true). It will reduce flow to the radiator and that has an unknown impact on cooling of the engine and trans (true). They say that is their justification to void the entire drivetrain and emissions warranty. Proving them wrong in court with nothing more than anecdotal evidence of it not causing the issue on other trucks is a battle I'm not up for.

TX-Ripper

Get the stock location replacement Whipple intercooler.

No cutting required and easy to reverse if needed.

mikeinatlanta

How would the Whipple address the winch fitment issue or warranty void issue?

chimmike

if it's stock location replacement, it doesn't address winch fitment issue.

Warranties do not automatically "get voided". Dealers don't have that power.

mikeinatlanta

Agree, however, the reality of the situation is that they have great influence advocating one way or the other. Have checked with three local service managers (managers, not writers) and all flatly state full powertrain and emissions warranty void as soon as they see the intercooler. One was kind enough to involve a Ford engineer who was at the dealership for another issue and he said the same for the reasons stated in my earlier post. If I had a local service manager that was willing to advocate for keeping warranty in tact then things might be different. Regardless, no point in trying to litigate it on this forum.

For me, it boils down to whether the 3.5 or 5.0 makes enough of a difference to risk it. The main reason I want the 3.5 is so that I can get a max tow package and 9.75 rear. Looking at other ways that don't risk warranty.

EDIT: While I don't see the point of arguing about warranty on a forum, I will say that being a very technical person, I would much rather be the guy in court arguing that the warranty should be denied due to an intercooler upgrade than the guy trying to prove that it doesn't hurt anything. Keep in mind that the upgraded intercooler requires removing the louvers, blocks flow to the upper radiator area, provides less intake restriction, and provides a colder air charge. Although maybe possible, proving it didn't contribute to that failed transmission or spun main bearing would be a very difficult battle, especially going up against Ford. Not a fight I want any part of.