What Engine makes sense for me?
01-11-2019, 04:06 PM
#221
great, now go look at the video and look at what I posted. The dyno in the video showed both the 3.5EB and 5.0 at about 170hp/290lb-ft at 3k and both at about 250hp/320lb-ft at 4k. I just found that interesting.
.......the video compared a 2015 EB and a 2018 5,0 and the 5.0 made more peak hp and more peak tq. The other thing to consider is that the tested trucks definitely had different transmissions, they may have had different gears too...did they properly adjust and change settings to reflect those facts? who knows. I was just responding to a video that someone else posted (and it did, in fact, show the 2.7 making more torque at low rpm than either the 3.5EB or 5.0). Obviously they have changed something in the 3.5EB for 2018 since the rating torque rating is quite a bit higher and I lamented the fact that they did not test all 2018's as it would have given a much better picture of current capabilities rather than mixing different years. .
.......the video compared a 2015 EB and a 2018 5,0 and the 5.0 made more peak hp and more peak tq. The other thing to consider is that the tested trucks definitely had different transmissions, they may have had different gears too...did they properly adjust and change settings to reflect those facts? who knows. I was just responding to a video that someone else posted (and it did, in fact, show the 2.7 making more torque at low rpm than either the 3.5EB or 5.0). Obviously they have changed something in the 3.5EB for 2018 since the rating torque rating is quite a bit higher and I lamented the fact that they did not test all 2018's as it would have given a much better picture of current capabilities rather than mixing different years. .
The 2015 3.5EB has a 6-speed.
In 2017, Ford upped the 3.5EB to have the 10-speed, plus a little more HP and quite a bit more torque.
So, that might kill the usefulness of the video.
01-11-2019, 04:08 PM
#222
They did elaborate a bit in the comments of that video... The 6-speed was run in 5th gear (nearest 1:1), while the 10-speed was run in 7th gear (exact 1:1). Not sure on rear-end gearing on any of them.
01-11-2019, 04:35 PM
#223
My 5.4 had 230,000 when I got rid of it still running fine. Original timing belt, water pump and starter. I had to change the alternator and battery.
I plan to get 200,000 + miles from this 5.0. At 114,000 now with the only issue a poor;y designed water pump.
01-11-2019, 04:59 PM
#224
Here we go again! Few folks "plan their budgets" when buying a vehicle. Their budgets are a result of the purchases they have made. All of them! Including those that pop up the day after your new truck hits your driveway. These days fuel is relatively cheap. $40 per month may not be a big deal. But not that long ago that number would have been $80 per month. (using your numbers) And you can bet those higher prices will once again return before the 60 payments are all made. Buying more truck then you really need becomes a part of that budget forever. The idiot who buys that new truck seldom knows he/she is an idiot until the reality sets in down the line when life throws a curve at you. That payment is cast in concrete until its paid off. Buying a truck with features you might use less than 1% of the time is what an idiot might do.
Getting back the question that started this thread, if necessary, buy what you can afford. If you're wealthy, buy what you want. But if this guy was wealthy, I doubt he would have posted the question in the first place! Apparently his budget was a factor.
Getting back the question that started this thread, if necessary, buy what you can afford. If you're wealthy, buy what you want. But if this guy was wealthy, I doubt he would have posted the question in the first place! Apparently his budget was a factor.
I want a truck that will be dependable and trouble free. I figure that if I am paying near 40k for a truck that I should not need to pay more and waste valuable time dealing with something that I planned to avoid . My budget is to get the best deal possible. I shop for white, super cab, 6 - 8 cargo box, 36 fuel tank capacity, 3:55 rear end ratio, 5.0 engine.
01-11-2019, 05:11 PM
#225
Senior Member
An engine is basically an air compressor with a little fuel thrown in for a bang. You are correct with your remark about load, but without the engine turning, (RPM's) their can be no load. Let's include everything needed to make the thing work. Like fuel, compression, atmospheric pressure etc. Ok, lets not. Let me just say that putting a load on an engine at idle will not allow a turbo to boost anything. You need that air flowing through and since the engine has a finite cubic inch it can only flow that much times the speed minus the inefficacies. Yeeks!
Supercharges, as I stated on "engines designed to use them" are intentionally sized to move more air then the engine itself. A roots type supercharger is a positive displacement device and is as close to 100% efficient as man can make them. They are mechanically connected to the crankshaft with a ratio and size to achieve the amount of boost desired. Boost defined as excess air.The static compression ratio of these engines are around six or seven to one. That is the difference between the volume of a cylinder at the bottom of the stroke compared to the volume at the top of the stroke. Usually measured using measured water. (CC's) The effective compression ratio after the supercharger does it's thing can go as high as thirty to one on some diesel engines and twenty five to one on many gasoline aircraft type engines. Merlin's Detroit two cycle diesels are examples. All of these devices come with relief valves to blow off the excess air when necessary. Yes these engines are in boost one hundred percent of the time. Some would not run at all without it. That is the main difference between a turbo and a supercharger. (Blower to the racers)
I may not have explained this with the quality of a collage thesis and it has been over ten years since I retired from a field working with all engine types including turbo-jet engines. And I'm sure some 9th district court judge could find some issue with it to prove me wrong. I apologize if I have misstated or omitted some detail. Just trying to help folks understand. (Now I'm getting political and will likely send this thread in yet another direction.)
I guess I should heed the requests to keep things shorter. My final line was asking how this subject got into this thread and I should have left it at that. I apologize for my part in hijacking it. And again, that's my final line.
01-11-2019, 06:14 PM
#226
I've been often accused of writing long posts. Every time I shorten them up this happens! But my friend, I was simply trying to keep it simple.
An engine is basically an air compressor with a little fuel thrown in for a bang. You are correct with your remark about load, but without the engine turning, (RPM's) their can be no load. Let's include everything needed to make the thing work. Like fuel, compression, atmospheric pressure etc. Ok, lets not. Let me just say that putting a load on an engine at idle will not allow a turbo to boost anything. You need that air flowing through and since the engine has a finite cubic inch it can only flow that much times the speed minus the inefficacies. Yeeks!
Supercharges, as I stated on "engines designed to use them" are intentionally sized to move more air then the engine itself. A roots type supercharger is a positive displacement device and is as close to 100% efficient as man can make them. They are mechanically connected to the crankshaft with a ratio and size to achieve the amount of boost desired. Boost defined as excess air.The static compression ratio of these engines are around six or seven to one. That is the difference between the volume of a cylinder at the bottom of the stroke compared to the volume at the top of the stroke. Usually measured using measured water. (CC's) The effective compression ratio after the supercharger does it's thing can go as high as thirty to one on some diesel engines and twenty five to one on many gasoline aircraft type engines. Merlin's Detroit two cycle diesels are examples. All of these devices come with relief valves to blow off the excess air when necessary. Yes these engines are in boost one hundred percent of the time. Some would not run at all without it. That is the main difference between a turbo and a supercharger. (Blower to the racers)
I may not have explained this with the quality of a collage thesis and it has been over ten years since I retired from a field working with all engine types including turbo-jet engines. And I'm sure some 9th district court judge could find some issue with it to prove me wrong. I apologize if I have misstated or omitted some detail. Just trying to help folks understand. (Now I'm getting political and will likely send this thread in yet another direction.)
I guess I should heed the requests to keep things shorter. My final line was asking how this subject got into this thread and I should have left it at that. I apologize for my part in hijacking it. And again, that's my final line.
An engine is basically an air compressor with a little fuel thrown in for a bang. You are correct with your remark about load, but without the engine turning, (RPM's) their can be no load. Let's include everything needed to make the thing work. Like fuel, compression, atmospheric pressure etc. Ok, lets not. Let me just say that putting a load on an engine at idle will not allow a turbo to boost anything. You need that air flowing through and since the engine has a finite cubic inch it can only flow that much times the speed minus the inefficacies. Yeeks!
Supercharges, as I stated on "engines designed to use them" are intentionally sized to move more air then the engine itself. A roots type supercharger is a positive displacement device and is as close to 100% efficient as man can make them. They are mechanically connected to the crankshaft with a ratio and size to achieve the amount of boost desired. Boost defined as excess air.The static compression ratio of these engines are around six or seven to one. That is the difference between the volume of a cylinder at the bottom of the stroke compared to the volume at the top of the stroke. Usually measured using measured water. (CC's) The effective compression ratio after the supercharger does it's thing can go as high as thirty to one on some diesel engines and twenty five to one on many gasoline aircraft type engines. Merlin's Detroit two cycle diesels are examples. All of these devices come with relief valves to blow off the excess air when necessary. Yes these engines are in boost one hundred percent of the time. Some would not run at all without it. That is the main difference between a turbo and a supercharger. (Blower to the racers)
I may not have explained this with the quality of a collage thesis and it has been over ten years since I retired from a field working with all engine types including turbo-jet engines. And I'm sure some 9th district court judge could find some issue with it to prove me wrong. I apologize if I have misstated or omitted some detail. Just trying to help folks understand. (Now I'm getting political and will likely send this thread in yet another direction.)
I guess I should heed the requests to keep things shorter. My final line was asking how this subject got into this thread and I should have left it at that. I apologize for my part in hijacking it. And again, that's my final line.
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OCMike (01-14-2019)
01-12-2019, 08:54 AM
#227
Senior Member
Turbo's are exhaust driven. Need higher RPM's (exh. airflow) to produce results. Super-chargers are geared. Pumps air at all times, but more than required at all speeds. Especially beneficial when used as originally intended. Slow turning diesels and aircraft engines. As HP is a calculation of time, (RPM's) no engine is "linear" as I think your trying to say. Or, they all do as all produce some torque at all RPM's. Eg: A 400 HP truck engine produces this around two thousand RPM's. Auto engines require five to eight thousand RPM's to achieve the same.
How did this thread turn into this subject?
How did this thread turn into this subject?
01-13-2019, 02:14 AM
#228
01-13-2019, 07:54 AM
#229
Senior Member
depends on the turbo.. smaller the turbo the faster it will spool and more power at lower RPM's .. actually that's not entirely true .. ball bearing turbo's make power down low too.. but traditionally the smaller the turbo the quicker it will make power
01-13-2019, 09:17 AM
#230
Senior Member
Speaking of turbos, my 2.7 had no issue making 8 lbs of boost at 1500 rpm's while towing that trailer down the highway.