When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
The max tow package is useless, unless you tow A LOT... It only adds another 1000lbs of towing capacity to the 3.5EB engine, which is not a lot...
My XLT (302a group) came equipped with the tow package and the FX4 package comes with the 3.55 E-lock. It is 10 700lbs rated.
Not sure on the V8 though, but it tows less than the 3.5EB, that's for sure. As for why, the torque might have something to do with it.
how is it useless? Its cheaper than its sum of parts, and an easier sell.
when I wss shopping (used), I didnt even consider trucks without max tow. I mean I guess if you had a slapped together combo of options that made it equal, but at the end of the day thats just someobe trying to justify how they "outsmarted" ford or something.
I think the HDPP and MAX tow are impressive packages on a half ton, with specific markets in mind, for example the half a year towing the larger TT crowed for the max tow, or the guy with a really big boat who only tows it 4 or 6 times a year. This truck and config is for the people who should have a super duty/hd truck, but only need those abilities a handful of times a year, and only need a half ton for the other 85% or more of the year, and want the fuel econ, comfort etc and lower price tag of the half ton.
Chief here towing his house on 3 axles at least has an HDPP and it looks set up decent.
I know I see hundreds of halfers towing 8-9k lb TTs where the TT is either nose diving or sky high, because the truck payload and hitch set up is wrong. Maybe in the prairies you get away with it, but my guess is in the mountains you wont.
If I were 3 axle house on wheels, Id have bought a heavy duty truck, but maybe he drives short trips in flat land at 55 mph, and was happier with his 5 or 6k saved and better fuel econ when not towing vs a superduty
Personally id buy more truck than the minimum for what I plan to tow and haul.
To the OP; Don't just go by the advertised towing because they'll always advertise the configuration that has the highest payload/towing spec.
Just like in commercials where they say "most fuel efficient and highest towing capability", well that's partially true, but you don't get BOTH out of one truck configuration. They're advertising their most fuel efficient and high towing configs at once, making it seem like a do-all truck, but it's not.
The reason for the different capacities is because of weight and power. The more the truck weighs, the less it can tow/haul. Engines are a little different because turbo and non-turbo are in different categories. The V8 weighs more and has less torque, so it tows less. Also, cab and features affect payload as well. A SuperCrew weighs more than a Regular Cab, taking away from it's capabilities. Same with 2wd and 4wd. ANYTHING you add takes away from what you can do. Moonroof for example reduces your payload because you're always carrying it essentially.
And click the year of model you're looking at buying. Then scroll to the F-150 section. Again, here's you'll see the max towing capability, but that's only if you pick the configuration that can actually tow it!
It has a nice laid out grid like so:
Here are all your capabilities. Note the number in the brackets because those will denote if that weight requires the HDPP, or specific sized wheels. Also note that there is a difference if towing conventional (bumper pull) or 5th wheel, they ARE different. There are 2 different grids for this for a reason.
THESE are your limits for both safety AND legal reasons. If you get pulled over to be weighed and you're over your limit, prepare to pay a fine and have to drop your trailer on the spot. If you're in an accident, your insurance company will leave you hanging and you'll be stuck with the bill for all damages to all vehicles and property.
Regardless of if it says a 3.5EB Longbox SuperCrew 4x2 can bumper-tow 13,200 lbs, that does NOT mean that any other configuration SHOULD do this. I say should, because you COULD tow it, you COULD tow 20,000 lbs too, but SHOULD you? No.
Also, if you have a 2016 truck, don't look at the 2018 specs sheet. The weights don't magically change from year to year, those are MODEL YEARS which do change because of changes and improvements to components.
It's not some kind of conspiracy here. Engineers test and set these numbers for a reason. It has nothing to do with marketing. Anyone who ignores these figures are just being ignorant of safety and the law. Choose the right truck configuration for what you want to tow, or vice versa. Any responsible adult should abide by the numbers. But in the end, if you want to be unsafe or break the law, that's up to you. Hopefully nobody gets hurt except for your wallet and driving record.
Im not trying to stir the pot here but, the towing guide Ford puts out there is just that. A guide and it is not accurate. The "guide" says my 17 HDPP has a max conventional tow rating of 10,400lbs but the sticker on my truck on the hitch clearly says 11,000lbs / 1,100lbs WDH tongue. Im going to go with the 11,000lb rating thats clearly printed on the truck itself. That will hold up in court all day over the "general guide"(the guide cannot cover every variation of F-150 produced). I do also believe the "Ford towing guide" you are referring to, does not say to stay under the GCWR anywhere. The only weights you will find Ford saying not to exceed is the GAWR & GVWR in the guide. The actual manual does not say anything about the legalities of exceeding GCWR and only that it "COULD" cause structural damaged and loss of control. If you believe any of my statements to be false, please, show me the print or fine print that states other wise. I always love to learn new stuff.
Probably because the hitch is not the weakest link here. The attaching hardware, the axle, the frame, etc are all part of the load bearing system. The 2018 has upgraded axle housing and frame and I suspect it will have a revision E or higher hitch for 13,200 lbs towing. The towing guide probably takes into account the weakest link in each chassis configuration with some safety margin.
Originally Posted by MagneticScrew
Im not trying to stir the pot here but, the towing guide Ford puts out there is just that. A guide and it is not accurate. The "guide" says my 17 HDPP has a max conventional tow rating of 10,400lbs but the sticker on my truck on the hitch clearly says 11,000lbs / 1,100lbs WDH tongue. Im going to go with the 11,000lb rating thats clearly printed on the truck itself. That will hold up in court all day over the "general guide"(the guide cannot cover every variation of F-150 produced). I do also believe the "Ford towing guide" you are referring to, does not say to stay under the GCWR anywhere. The only weights you will find Ford saying not to exceed is the GAWR & GVWR in the guide. The actual manual does not say anything about the legalities of exceeding GCWR and only that it "COULD" cause structural damaged and loss of control. If you believe any of my statements to be false, please, show me the print or fine print that states other wise. I always love to learn new stuff.
Dont play around with that "Max Tow" package. For towing you need PAYLOAD! Get the HDPP and u get all of it plus you will have BIG LEAGUE payload.
HDPP comes with 3.73:1 9.75" diff and its rated for 4,800lbs.
Having a 12,000lb tow rating and not having the PAYLOAD to support that weight = **** on a bull.
AND, with HDPP you can tow a 5th wheel and not have to worry about the conventinal trailer wagging the truck.
17 HDPP 5.0L towing my 12,000lb loaded 5er.
Does great!
Sorry but if I needed to tow a trailer like that I definitely would have gone with an F250/f350. Why pull something constantly at the top end of the capabilities of your truck? Can it do it? yes but for how long.
I'm seeing some shenanigans with these package availability and tow ratings.
Trailer Tow Package nets you:
• 4-pin/7-pin wiring harness
• Auxiliary transmission oil cooler
• Class IV trailer hitch receiver
• Pro Trailer Backup Assist (not included on XL Base)
• Tailgate LED (standard on LARIAT and higher)
• Smart Trailer Tow Connector (standard on LARIAT and higher)
• Upgraded front stabilizer bar
Max Tow Package nets you:
Includes:
• 3.55 Electronic-locking rear-axle
• 4-pin/7-pin wiring harness
• 36 Gallon fuel tank
• Auxiliary transmission oil cooler
• Engine oil cooler
• Class IV trailer hitch receiver
• Pro Trailer Backup Assist with Tailgate LED
• Smart Trailer Tow Connector (standard on LARIAT and higher)
• Integrated Trailer Brake Controller
• Upgraded front stabilizer bar
• Upgraded rear bumper
The Max Tow REQUIRES the 3.5 Ecoboost and is not available with a 5.0 V8. My 5.0 V8 has the 3.55 gears, TBC, and 36gal tank as options you automatically get with the Max Tow. However, my trucks tow rating is 9000lbs while the same Ecoboost Max Tow truck is almost 12,000lbs. Now, trucks have been towing 12,000lbs with less than 385hp/387lb-ft and the "upgraded bumper" does not affect towing from the receiver hitch. So are you telling the the engine oil cooler is the difference between 3000lbs or is Ford just trying to sell Ecoboosts?
My suggestion, after buying a max tow package f150. If you are going to be towing anything over 8-9k, just go get a 250 or 350 diesel. Night and day difference.
Im not trying to stir the pot here but, the towing guide Ford puts out there is just that. A guide and it is not accurate. The "guide" says my 17 HDPP has a max conventional tow rating of 10,400lbs but the sticker on my truck on the hitch clearly says 11,000lbs / 1,100lbs WDH tongue. Im going to go with the 11,000lb rating thats clearly printed on the truck itself. That will hold up in court all day over the "general guide"(the guide cannot cover every variation of F-150 produced). I do also believe the "Ford towing guide" you are referring to, does not say to stay under the GCWR anywhere. The only weights you will find Ford saying not to exceed is the GAWR & GVWR in the guide. The actual manual does not say anything about the legalities of exceeding GCWR and only that it "COULD" cause structural damaged and loss of control. If you believe any of my statements to be false, please, show me the print or fine print that states other wise. I always love to learn new stuff.
You may want to look at that grid again, it's the 3rd column... It goes Engine, Axle Ratio, GCWR, etc... It is clearly stated.
Of course there's also more to it than that when it comes to restrictions. GVWR, rGAWR, tongue weight, payload, etc. Basically, whichever limit you hit first is your limit, period.
And you state that your truck clearly says 11,000 lbs, but you said your trailer is 12,000 lbs, and earlier you said you have a 12,000 lb tow rating...
Last edited by BlackBoost; 09-25-2017 at 10:45 AM.
In the real world, the 5.0L will tow just as much as the 3.5EB, in my opinion. If anything, it might handle slightly better because the 5L weighs a little bit more.
No law enforcement officer has access or even cares about the GCWR of a non commercial vehicle. If the tow vehicle is loaded within the limits of the GVWR, and the trailer is not loaded in such a manner to exceed the axle ratings, and GVWR of the trailer then it's a non issue. Just the information provided on the federal sticker.
The majority of crashes involving RV's are single vehicle. If no or minor injuries are reported at the time of the crash, then the cause of the crash will fall under failure to control. If evidence of trailer sway, then maybe the cause could be written as excessive speed causing trailer sway. No need to weigh anything.
If serious injury or death, then the vehicle might be weighed if the weight of the vehicle might be a contributing factor. Most investigators would have the vehicle weighed just to rule it out. If the vehicle is found to be over weight, the investigator would have to break it down to the specific elements as to why the weight of the vehicle contributed to the injuries.
Most states have some type of unsafe vehicle law. If a vehicle is loaded in such a manner to make it unsafe to operate on a highway, the investigator would have to articulate why the vehicle is unsafe. Again, weight might be a factor, but not the only issue. Excessive weight may cause brake failure, or axle failure, or tire problems, but it would be a mechanical failure that contributed to the crash.
A crash involving another party or vehicle and is not determined to be the fault of the rv driver. No need to weigh.
If a rv driver fails to stop at an intersection, or rear ends a vehicle and causes serious injury or death, and the driver is found to be at fault, then a vehicle weight would be obtained. Again to rule out weight being a contributing factor.
When you have a F250 with a GVWR of 10000, with a 2900 lb payload, the 10000 rating is for DOT purposes so you don't have to pay more for registration. If you exceeded the 10000 lb rating you could be cited for over weight. If you were weighed by DOT. No other agencies care.
If you are in a commercial operation, all FMCA rules apply.
A lot of factors go into a crash investigation. Seldom is one specific event the cause of a driver losing control of a vehicle. Weight is just one of many elements.
No law enforcement officer has access or even cares about the GCWR of a non commercial vehicle. If the tow vehicle is loaded within the limits of the GVWR, and the trailer is not loaded in such a manner to exceed the axle ratings, and GVWR of the trailer then it's a non issue. Just the information provided on the federal sticker.
The majority of crashes involving RV's are single vehicle. If no or minor injuries are reported at the time of the crash, then the cause of the crash will fall under failure to control. If evidence of trailer sway, then maybe the cause could be written as excessive speed causing trailer sway. No need to weigh anything.
If serious injury or death, then the vehicle might be weighed if the weight of the vehicle might be a contributing factor. Most investigators would have the vehicle weighed just to rule it out. If the vehicle is found to be over weight, the investigator would have to break it down to the specific elements as to why the weight of the vehicle contributed to the injuries.
Most states have some type of unsafe vehicle law. If a vehicle is loaded in such a manner to make it unsafe to operate on a highway, the investigator would have to articulate why the vehicle is unsafe. Again, weight might be a factor, but not the only issue. Excessive weight may cause brake failure, or axle failure, or tire problems, but it would be a mechanical failure that contributed to the crash.
A crash involving another party or vehicle and is not determined to be the fault of the rv driver. No need to weigh.
If a rv driver fails to stop at an intersection, or rear ends a vehicle and causes serious injury or death, and the driver is found to be at fault, then a vehicle weight would be obtained. Again to rule out weight being a contributing factor.
When you have a F250 with a GVWR of 10000, with a 2900 lb payload, the 10000 rating is for DOT purposes so you don't have to pay more for registration. If you exceeded the 10000 lb rating you could be cited for over weight. If you were weighed by DOT. No other agencies care.
If you are in a commercial operation, all FMCA rules apply.
A lot of factors go into a crash investigation. Seldom is one specific event the cause of a driver losing control of a vehicle. Weight is just one of many elements.
Agreed. But if there is a crash in which they deem could not be avoided, or was made worse because of overloaded weight, then you are at fault. There are Federal Regulations to follow here. If you've overloaded your weight, then you've affected your stopping distance, which is laid out in Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, making you at fault.
I'm sure on top of this, each State also has its own regulations. Failing anything else, there's always the general "unsafe load" and/or "excessive speed".
09-14-2017, 10:15 PM
