Cummins 4bt or 6bt Swap
02-02-2013, 10:33 PM
#61
Heat Miser
The 6-cyls are cheaper believe it or not, and you gotta be careful of the Chinese-made 4bt's-which apparently there's a LOT of out there.
IIRC, if you're gonna be pulling one out of a delivery truck made in the last 10-years It's GONNA be of Chinese origin, but I've also got CRS, so YMMV.
Obviously you're not gonna have an easy time getting the 6-cyl into a Jeep, Ranger/S-10, older Bronco, or any other vehicle that originally came with a small(er) motor, and there's some 4bt's out there putting out 400hp+, and they're doing it reliably.
Me personally, I'm doing a Cummins swap into a 2005 F250 with a friend, and/as there's TONS of info on doing it on the web, and TONS of conversion parts for it.
I would only do a 4bt install in a vehicle that just doesn't have the room for the 6-cyl. There's just TOO much up-side to the 6-cyl, and hardly ANY downside.
They're freaking bullet-proof, PLENTIFUL(which is an understatement), easy to get parts for, and easy to get power out of.
1/2's chassis and running gear aren't made to handle the torque loads of a modern diesel, so installing a Cummins 6cyl into one would require 3/4 ton gears and axles, which will require 3/4 ton hubs then brakes, so you'd be better off removing an entire 3/4 running gear and installing it on your 1/2 ton.
Then you have the chassis. I can't tell you just how much you'd need, suffice it to say it would take a LOT of bracing on a 1/2 ton chassis to be able to hold up to modern diesel torque-loads. We're talking MINIMUM 600-ft/lbs, and that's WITHOUT any mods or a programmer installed. It's more likely that you'd be dealing with 800-ft/lbs of torque. You'd also have to deal with clearancing the body for the transmission. GM HD's have thick body-mount spacers to clear their Allison transmissions, but even other diesel-capable tranny's wouldn't fit in 1/2 ton trans tunnels.
All things considered, it'd just be WAY more time and cost-efficient starting with a 3/4 or 1-ton truck, and installing the motor/trans into that.
IIRC, if you're gonna be pulling one out of a delivery truck made in the last 10-years It's GONNA be of Chinese origin, but I've also got CRS, so YMMV.
Obviously you're not gonna have an easy time getting the 6-cyl into a Jeep, Ranger/S-10, older Bronco, or any other vehicle that originally came with a small(er) motor, and there's some 4bt's out there putting out 400hp+, and they're doing it reliably.
Me personally, I'm doing a Cummins swap into a 2005 F250 with a friend, and/as there's TONS of info on doing it on the web, and TONS of conversion parts for it.
I would only do a 4bt install in a vehicle that just doesn't have the room for the 6-cyl. There's just TOO much up-side to the 6-cyl, and hardly ANY downside.
They're freaking bullet-proof, PLENTIFUL(which is an understatement), easy to get parts for, and easy to get power out of.
A 12v weights in at 975lbs and a 24v weighs 1,150lbs. The 4BT weights 782. Adjustments will have to be made to the front end of the 1/2 ton truck to hold a 6BT and maybe even the 4BT. The weight of these motors will be the issue. Your front suspension wont last very long witht that kind of weight. Remember that the 4BT weights around double of what your 4.6L would weigh.
The 4BT would be less powerful than your original 4.6L as far as stock hp and torque goes.
The 4BT would be less powerful than your original 4.6L as far as stock hp and torque goes.
Then you have the chassis. I can't tell you just how much you'd need, suffice it to say it would take a LOT of bracing on a 1/2 ton chassis to be able to hold up to modern diesel torque-loads. We're talking MINIMUM 600-ft/lbs, and that's WITHOUT any mods or a programmer installed. It's more likely that you'd be dealing with 800-ft/lbs of torque. You'd also have to deal with clearancing the body for the transmission. GM HD's have thick body-mount spacers to clear their Allison transmissions, but even other diesel-capable tranny's wouldn't fit in 1/2 ton trans tunnels.
All things considered, it'd just be WAY more time and cost-efficient starting with a 3/4 or 1-ton truck, and installing the motor/trans into that.
Last edited by yokev; 02-02-2013 at 10:46 PM.
02-15-2013, 06:54 PM
#62
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02-15-2013, 07:03 PM
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The 6-cyls are cheaper believe it or not, and you gotta be careful of the Chinese-made 4bt's-which apparently there's a LOT of out there.
IIRC, if you're gonna be pulling one out of a delivery truck made in the last 10-years It's GONNA be of Chinese origin, but I've also got CRS, so YMMV.
Obviously you're not gonna have an easy time getting the 6-cyl into a Jeep, Ranger/S-10, older Bronco, or any other vehicle that originally came with a small(er) motor, and there's some 4bt's out there putting out 400hp+, and they're doing it reliably.
Me personally, I'm doing a Cummins swap into a 2005 F250 with a friend, and/as there's TONS of info on doing it on the web, and TONS of conversion parts for it.
I would only do a 4bt install in a vehicle that just doesn't have the room for the 6-cyl. There's just TOO much up-side to the 6-cyl, and hardly ANY downside.
They're freaking bullet-proof, PLENTIFUL(which is an understatement), easy to get parts for, and easy to get power out of.
1/2's chassis and running gear aren't made to handle the torque loads of a modern diesel, so installing a Cummins 6cyl into one would require 3/4 ton gears and axles, which will require 3/4 ton hubs then brakes, so you'd be better off removing an entire 3/4 running gear and installing it on your 1/2 ton.
Then you have the chassis. I can't tell you just how much you'd need, suffice it to say it would take a LOT of bracing on a 1/2 ton chassis to be able to hold up to modern diesel torque-loads. We're talking MINIMUM 600-ft/lbs, and that's WITHOUT any mods or a programmer installed. It's more likely that you'd be dealing with 800-ft/lbs of torque. You'd also have to deal with clearancing the body for the transmission. GM HD's have thick body-mount spacers to clear their Allison transmissions, but even other diesel-capable tranny's wouldn't fit in 1/2 ton trans tunnels.
All things considered, it'd just be WAY more time and cost-efficient starting with a 3/4 or 1-ton truck, and installing the motor/trans into that.
IIRC, if you're gonna be pulling one out of a delivery truck made in the last 10-years It's GONNA be of Chinese origin, but I've also got CRS, so YMMV.
Obviously you're not gonna have an easy time getting the 6-cyl into a Jeep, Ranger/S-10, older Bronco, or any other vehicle that originally came with a small(er) motor, and there's some 4bt's out there putting out 400hp+, and they're doing it reliably.
Me personally, I'm doing a Cummins swap into a 2005 F250 with a friend, and/as there's TONS of info on doing it on the web, and TONS of conversion parts for it.
I would only do a 4bt install in a vehicle that just doesn't have the room for the 6-cyl. There's just TOO much up-side to the 6-cyl, and hardly ANY downside.
They're freaking bullet-proof, PLENTIFUL(which is an understatement), easy to get parts for, and easy to get power out of.
1/2's chassis and running gear aren't made to handle the torque loads of a modern diesel, so installing a Cummins 6cyl into one would require 3/4 ton gears and axles, which will require 3/4 ton hubs then brakes, so you'd be better off removing an entire 3/4 running gear and installing it on your 1/2 ton.
Then you have the chassis. I can't tell you just how much you'd need, suffice it to say it would take a LOT of bracing on a 1/2 ton chassis to be able to hold up to modern diesel torque-loads. We're talking MINIMUM 600-ft/lbs, and that's WITHOUT any mods or a programmer installed. It's more likely that you'd be dealing with 800-ft/lbs of torque. You'd also have to deal with clearancing the body for the transmission. GM HD's have thick body-mount spacers to clear their Allison transmissions, but even other diesel-capable tranny's wouldn't fit in 1/2 ton trans tunnels.
All things considered, it'd just be WAY more time and cost-efficient starting with a 3/4 or 1-ton truck, and installing the motor/trans into that.
