stormrider151

One thing that will help sort all this out is Tylenol. I'm trying to get my TT dialed in and it seems to help...........a little. :-)

Boulevard

There is no difference between the 3.55 and 3.73 equipped trucks other than 100 rpm and 100RPM equals absolutely nothing. I think that FORD is disgracing itself with what I think is 100% profit taking. Not to say that there isn't a difference but 2000lbs is way out of line.


I am not a big fan of torturing numbers but I am a big fan of safety. I honestly believe that YOU can safely do what you are suggesting and I also believe that YOU can un-safely do what you are suggesting. Use a high quality WDH and set it up right (this is key), drive at reasonable speeds, test run every load before you head out on a trip to be sure that it is stable and that you are comfortable. Basically, be reasonable, be smart, be safe.


Remember, your truck and the 9500lb truck are the EXACT same truck other than the gear set. You are not going to hurt your truck and safety has more to do with you than some numbers printed on the drivers side door. In the end it will be up to you to decide what is and what is not safe and my best advice to you is that you drive within your comfort level and not someone else's.

f3user

I learned a lot from all the replies today. I want to summarize what I think I learned, feel free to correct me if need be:

1) Ford's max towing numbers don't mean anything, rather it's about the payload capacity of your truck located in the door jamb and the rated capacity of your tow hitch. So a truck with 1550 lbs of payload capacity would safely tow the same amount of trailer whether gear was 3.55, 3.73, or even 4.10.

2) The factory class IV 2" hitch is rated for 500 lbs of tongue weight without WDH and 1050 lbs with. Since about 13% of trailer wt should be on tongue, without WDH you can pull about 500 / .13 = 3,846 lbs and with WHD about 1050 / .13 = 8,077 lbs. That assumes I have only put 493 lbs of additional cargo in the truck in my case to have the full 1050 lbs of remaining payload capacity for tongue weight.

3) The most important factor in all of this is sitting in the driver seat. Make sure loads are balanced, secured, proper tongue weight, WDH is setup right, don't speed, etc.

Thanks again for your input.

Boulevard

Carefull with that #1 there. FORD's numbers do mean something but when it comes to these 2 gear sets it has more to do with marketing than reality. That said I would never exceed pulling 9000lbs at hwy speeds with ANY F150.


Truck loading is a real issue. FORD specs, if adhered to, can really but a damper on your towing and very few people either understand it or follow it and again, set up is key. Putting 1000lbs at the tailgate is not what FORD meant and it is unsafe where putting 1000lbs. behind the cab is exactly what FORD meant and it is safe. The weight has to be in the right spot and that is where the WDH comes in. The WDH will 'move' the weight further into the truck in order to properly distribute the weight and make the truck safe. So how much is to much? Google how to properly load and set a truck and its load...measure at both front and rear wheel wells... be smart. I would say that it took me about 8 hours of set up and fidgeting and adjusting before I was really happy with my current set up. 2 hours of set up in your buddies back yard is not going to cut it.

smokeywren

Quote:

Originally Posted by f3user

1) Ford's max towing numbers don't mean anything, rather it's about the payload capacity of your truck located in the door jamb and the rated capacity of your tow hitch. So a truck with 1550 lbs of payload capacity would safely tow the same amount of trailer whether gear was 3.55, 3.73, or even 4.10.

No. You're on the right track, but poorly stated.

There are two basic weight ratings to be concerned with when towing = GCWR and GVWR. GCWR limits the total weight you can PULL. GVWR limits the total weight, including hitch weight, you can HAUL.

GCWR is the max weight of the combined truck and trailer. Subtract the weight of the truck from the GCWR and the answer is the tow rating, or the max weight of a trailer you can tow without exceeding the GCWR. The factory tow rating is overstated because they use the shipping weight of the truck as the weight of the truck, with absolutely nothing in the truck but a skinny driver. So the GCWR is a real weight limit established by professional engineers (PEs), but the factory tow rating is a contrived number you should ignore and compute your own realistic tow rating.

The GCWR tells you the maximum weight that a well-maintained engine and drivetrain can pull without overheating anything in the drivetrain, and without being the slowpoke holding up traffic on steep grades. So it's a very important limiter. But on F-150s before the 2015 model year, it's not the weight limiter you have to worry about, because you'll run out of hauling capacity before you get close to pulling capacity..

Your realistic tow rating is the GCWR minus the weight of the wet and loaded truck. To compute yours, load the truck with everything that will be in it when towing, including the trailer hitch, toolbox full of tools, campfire wood, people, pets, whatever. Drive to a truck stop that has a CAT scale and fill up with gas, then weigh the wet and loaded truck (including driver and passengers). Subtract the weight of the truck from the GCWR and the answer is your realistic tow rating.


The GCWR depends primarily on the engine power and torque, along with the leverage applied by the axle ratio. It also involves the cooling systems that prevent the components in the drivetrain from overheating, and the strength of the frame and rear axle to pull that much weight. An EcoBoost engine in an F-150 has more tow rating that a 5.0L with the same axle ratio because the EcoBoost engine has more power and torque.

However, on most trucks with single rear wheels (SRW), the GCWR is not the limiter as to max trailer weight you can tow without being overloaded. Even a realistic tow rating may not be the limiter as to the max trailer weight you can tow without being overloaded. The GVWR is usually the limiter. Perhaps that's what you meant by your statement: "Ford's max towing numbers don't mean anything..."?

The GVWR tells you the maximum weight the truck can weigh on the two truck axles. The GVWR limits the weight you can haul in the truck, including hitch weight. GVWR minus the weight of the truck gives you the available payload capacity. If that wet and loaded truck included all the people and stuff that will be in it when towing, then the remaining payload capacity is available for hitch weight.

Divide that remaining payload capacity by 0.15 and the answer is the max travel trailer weight you can tow without exceeding the GVWR of your truck. Divide that remaining payload by 0.20 and the answer is the max weight of most fifth-wheel RV trailers you can tow without exceeding the GVWR of your truck.


The GVWR is primarily the weight ratings of the suspension, tires, wheels and brakes. It has nothing to do with power and torque.

Now you have a realistic tow rating that is the maximum weight of any trailer you can tow without exceeding the GCWR of the truck, and you have a good number for the maximum weight of any TT you can tow without exceeding the GVWR of your truck. Whichever of those two max trailer weights is the smallest is your limit as to the maximum weight of any TT you want to consider towing with your truck.

But you're not through yet. You must be sure your hitch receiver is rated to pull the max trailer weight and to haul the max hitch weight of the trailer. That usually means you need a weight-distributing hitch. And you must load the trailer to have good hitch weight percent. For a TT, you want to try to achieve 12% to 13% wet and loaded tongue weight. You absolutely must have at least 10% tongue weight on a TT, and lots of TTs have 15% tongue weight when wet and loaded for the road.

f3user

I appreciate you correcting me and expanding my knowledge of GCWR. I'm learning more and also realizing how much a lot of guys out there don't know also. In talking to trailer sales people I'm finding out that some people are hauling heavy tractors on 6K or 7K lb GVWR carhaulers that I wouldn't, or they are bumper pulling 12-14K GVWR trailers without WDH. When I asked one person about a weight distributing hitch, he told I didn't need it, I could just get air bags or super springs to level the truck. I realize that would level the truck, but it wouldn't distribute any weight away from the tongue or rear axle.
It seems like people are taking one of two approaches to towing. One group tries to find the limiting factor in their setup (probably the available payload for tongue weight) and realize they need a bigger truck or should tow less weight and the other group just figures if the truck will pull it, it's okay!!

Blackpony

I agree with the gearing comments to an extent. My regular cab 5.0 truck with 3.31 gears is rated at 8300 lbs towing capacity. I cannot see your truck not being able to at least match that weight. The gearing does make a difference. For me going to a 3.73 gear will make a pretty good difference when it comes to how the truck would react to towing much weight.

Reefertek

One other thing you will want to do is get rid of the P tires and get LT load range E tires.

OneBlue150

I didn't see this mentioned yet, but insurance companies might feel they should not pay for any damages if you are driving an "unsafely loaded vehicle".

If your truck is rated to PULL 5000 lbs and you get in an accident while pulling 6000 lbs, chance are they will drop you and not cover any damages IF they find out that you were in fact pulling too much weight.

I have not experienced anything like this myself, but I have heard stories from a few coworkers.
Just something to keep in mind when deciding whether or no to follow the weight limits printed on the door jamb.

Wannafbody

This is Ford's %$#@%$ up numbers game at work. A 14 F150 5.0 with 7350 GVWR has almost 2000# less tow rating than my 13 EB with 7200 GVWR or my 09 5.3 Silverado with 7000 GVWR. In the real world, Ford's tow rating is worthless or the Silverado kicks Ford's butt to the curb, take yer pick.