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-   -   Need help to fix low sitting rear when towing (http://www.f150forum.com/f82/need-help-fix-low-sitting-rear-when-towing-172495/)

jgalaxy 09-17-2012 10:59 AM

Need help to fix low sitting rear when towing
 
I'm hoping the community can help me. I have a F150 EB SCAB 4x4 with max tow package. I pull a 30' V nose trailer (with the V). Trailer, toys and equipment weighs 9300lbs.

In general the EB pulls the load no problem, except I suffer two problems.

1. The rear end sits low with my head lights never reaching the road.
2. I also suffer a little bit a tail wagging when fast SUVs, mini vans or large cars pass me.

Looking for a remedy, opinions ...

brulaz 09-17-2012 01:53 PM

How is your WDH set up? It should be bringing your nose right down. Ford says to reduce the lift at the front axle by half.

thiggins 09-17-2012 02:19 PM

You could also try the . I'm getting them soon.

jgalaxy 09-17-2012 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brulaz (Post 2038238)
How is your WDH set up? It should be bringing your nose right down. Ford says to reduce the lift at the front axle by half.

There is no WDH. Trailer tongue hooked up to hitch pin directly. I'm not sure how I can reduce the lift in the front without raising the rear.

With the trailer fully loaded and hitched up, at the front I'm 38" from the ground to the wheel well and in the rear I'm ~37.25". Unloaded the front is ~38" and rear is ~40". So fully loaded she sits ~2.75" lower in the rear than unloaded.

I visited a trailer service depot earlier today and they gave me 2 suggestions. Balloon kit for the rear that I can adjust with air (manually or with optional compressor kit) when hauling, or install what they called a torsion bar system to help level the load. The down side is that because I have a V-nose they'll have to do some cutting to gain access to where these bar/chain system hook up on the A frame.

Ballon kit with manual air installed $645
Torsion bar (12K lbs) $400 + installation and trailer mods $485

I'd love to do just the balloon system if I could get away with it.

On the fence.

brulaz 09-17-2012 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgalaxy (Post 2038360)
There is no WDH. Trailer tongue hooked up to hitch pin directly. I'm not sure how I can reduce the lift in the front without raising the rear.

With the trailer fully loaded and hitched up, at the front I'm 38" from the ground to the wheel well and in the rear I'm ~37.25". Unloaded the front is ~38" and rear is ~40". So fully loaded she sits ~2.75" lower in the rear than unloaded.

I visited a trailer service depot earlier today and they gave me 2 suggestions. Balloon kit for the rear that I can adjust with air (manually or with optional compressor kit) when hauling, or install what they called a torsion bar system to help level the load. The down side is that because I have a V-nose they'll have to do some cutting to gain access to where these bar/chain system hook up on the A frame.

Ballon kit with manual air installed $645
Torsion bar (12K lbs) $400 + installation and trailer mods $485

I'd love to do just the balloon system if I could get away with it.

On the fence.

WDH have the very real advantage of moving weight from your rear axle to the front (and to the trailer's axle). The added weight in the front really helps with handling as well as helping level the truck.

Air bags (balloon system), xtra springs and so on help stiffen the suspension and raise the rear, but do not move any of that weight back to the front axle.

In general if your trailer's tongue weight is >500-600# you need a WDH first. Get that set up properly, then see how the truck handles. You may find the suspension too soft and so try air bags, xtra springs or whatever to improve the handling.

The torsion bar system they are talking about is probably a WDH. I'm surprised that a 33' V-nose is not built for to support a WDH. That's a big trailer and when loaded really should have a hefty tongue weight to keep it from swaying when on the road. And with a hefty tongue weight (>500-600#) you need a WDH.

You might be able to move things around in the trailer to reduce your tongue weight but it really should be at least 10% of trailer weight, 12% is better. mine is 14%.

brulaz 09-17-2012 03:42 PM

Just re-read your post.

If your front has little or no lift when loaded, then your tongue weight is probably less than 500-600# and so you can do without the WDH and just do the suspension stuff.

But I'm surprised that your tongue weight is so low with a trailer that big. I'd put it on some CAT scales, fully loaded, and be sure that tongue weight is 10-15% of trailer weight.

humblerb 09-17-2012 03:57 PM

I'm surprised that you have no rise in the front with a 9300# trailer. Matter of fact, I'm going to say I'm about 99% sure that is not accurate (without a WD hitch). The only way I can see that happening is if you are extremely back heavy on the trailer, which is another problem.
At 9300# trailer weight, your tongue should be 1200# +/-, probably more. If you are 1200# tongue weight, there is no way you only sag 2.75" in the back AND the front has zero rise in it. Just doesn't happen.
Something sure seems to be missing in your info.

brulaz 09-17-2012 04:24 PM

humbelrb is right.

Is this toy hauler trailer? Like for towing around that nice BMW in your avatar? If so, you've got the car loaded way too far in the back. Guaranteed to cause serious trailer sway. Move it up so at least 10% of the loaded weight is on the tongue, >930#, get a WDH setup properly, and now see how it works.

willieboy 09-17-2012 04:37 PM

The reason the trailer is likely "wagging" or swaying is the low tongue weight. This sway can get really dangerous, and if not handled, is truely endangering you and your family. You get 9300lbs swaying around on even a 1ton, and it is going to have the potential to pull the rear end of the truck around and cause a real issue. So first, get that trailer to the scales and figure out how to move load around to get the proper loading (as mentioned, 12-15% on the tongue).

Next, even a v-nose should be able to have WDH, even if it is a specialty setup. Here is one I found with a quick Google search: http://www.etrailer.com/question-8873.html There are also some threads on the Forest River forums that say the Equal-I-zer brand will work out of the box. I personally have the Equal-I-Zer and can say if is very easy to use and does a great job (although I amusing it on a traditional RV).

The last question is payload. Assuming a 5.5' bed you have a payload rating of no more than 2000lbs (yellow sticker on the door jam will have the payload for YOUR truck as built). Properly setup, you should have ~1200lbs of tongue weight, leaving you only 800 lbs of payload. The way Ford calculates it, payload is the carrying capacity of the truck full of fuel, but no driver. So pretty much anything you add to the truck removes payload. That includes people, gear, optional accessories, etc... 800lbs is doable, but no too easily. Furthermore, you will need to check your rear axle rating. At 4050 total load, I suspect you will run out of capacity of the rear axle before you hit payload.

humblerb 09-17-2012 04:49 PM

One more thing, air bags should only be used to enhance a perfectly set up WDH. They should not be used as the primary method of lifting (or lowering) the truck.


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