LTC F

"Don't think it's that simple."

In the US it is that simple. Diesel costs more than gas in the US where Ford sells 80% of its F150s. To pay the $1,000 (and that's a conservative estimate) difference between Ram's diesel and an EB you'd have to drive 100,000 miles, not including the more expensive maintenance and adding urea at $20 a gallon every 10k miles. The fact that an EB can tow more than the Ram Fiat diesel is a bonus.

Wannafbody

A 1/2 ton truck isn't made for towing a 37 ft TT.

acadianbob

Yep, subtract 10 to 15% from your fuel mileage on the diesel to make up the difference in fuel cost. 28 mpg minus 15% is about 23 to 24 mpg equivalent to gas. Then add the extra maintenance costs and the one time cost (3,000 over a hemi) to buy the diesel. No way that adds up in a 1/2 ton.

The Ecoboost matches the diesel in torque and exceeds it in horsepower. Ford has it right.

tomb1269

My 2cents is I do not see many gas engines used in tractor/truck pulling. Diesels have been know for years to be more effeicent pullers and in the past 15 years diesel programmers have saturated the market. A diesel can be opened up so much more with a simple tune then most current gas engines. Not sure what a good tune on an EB would do as it also uses direct injection similar to a diesel. You might be able to open it up for more as well. However, a 6 cylinder pushing the otrque and HP of the EB I assumed has to be nearly maxed out.

brulaz

OK, so I got out my spreadsheet.

Here are the lowest prices in California according to diesel buddy:
Reg. US$3.75
Prem. US$3.90
Diesel US$3.80
(Probably should have used average prices, but oh well)

Over the last 3 years, I've towed my 7500# trailer about 6835mi (11,000km) per year, and driven about the same w/o the trailer.

I know my EcoBoost mileage towing (10.0 mpgUS) and not towing (19.2 mpgUS) precisely. I tow with Premium gas as recommended by Ford, but use regular when not towing.

So if I lived in California and drove the same as I've done over the last 3 years, my yearly fuel costs with the EcoBoost would be US$2663 towing and $1336 not towing, or about US$3999 total/yr.

If I had an Ecodiesel in the same truck instead of the EcoBoost, what would those numbers look like? If I figure 14 mpg towing (but I've seen much higher numbers out there, like 19.5 mpg here: http://www.dieselpowermag.com/featur...er_towing.html) and 24 mpg not Towing, I get a total annual fuel cost of US$2945, a bit over $1000 per year less than the EcoBoost.

In Canada the difference is even more dramatic as our fuel costs are much higher. Using today's gas buddy #'s for Toronto, I get Can$7362 per year fuel cost for my EcoBoost, but only Can$4801 for the EcoDiesel. That's a Can$2500/year fuel cost difference. No wonder VW sells so many of their little diesel sedans up here.

Of course you can fudge these numbers all sorts of different ways. But generally these 3L V6 diesels really can save on fuel costs, especially up here in Canada. In the right truck, I would definitely be interested. But the RAM Ecodiesel isn't it; I need more payload than the RAM offers. So for me, the F150 with the EcoBoost is remains the best choice.

Norotso

With the maximum payload of a EcoDiesel being I believe around 900-1100#, you wont be pulling any 7500# trailer...

brulaz

I've heard of some fancy ones around 800# payload. But this is exactly what I'm saying: *only* if the EcoDiesel were put in a more capable truck, would I be interested.

I would consider trading the Ecoboost's better HP for the Ecodiesel's better mileage. (The max torque is about the same, although the Ecodiesel's max is at 1500 rpm not 2500 rpm). The big question in my mind is just how much better the Ecodiesel's mileage will be when towing. I've seen numbers all over.

But this is all just a waste of time if RAM doesn't make a better 1500, or Ford doesn't consider a similar diesel.

I'm not holding my breath. Just keeping my eyes open.

Flags

Yeah, I know. That's why I have the SuperDuty to tow it with. When the time comes to sell my F-250 SuperDuty I'm going to make the jump to the F-450 to tow the 5th wheel.

I'm not asking if the F-150 with a diesel would tow the rig, I'm merely asking for opinions on whether anyone thinks Ford will put a diesel in the F-150 in the future.

StinsonEB

I am not sure what the chances are that a diesel will make its way into the F150 but I do think that Ford is positioned to react quickly should the diesel engine be needed to remain competitive in the market. We will see how well Dodge, Nissan, and now Toyota do with the their diesels the next few years.

I think Ford is a position to react, because for the 2014 MY you can buy a 5cyl diesel in the Ford Transit van. Sure the HP and TRQ numbers might not be very competitive, but with some software tweaks it might be where it needs to be. Ford has invested a lot of money to meet the EPA requirements for this engine to be in the van. One can only assume that maybe they will be getting some additional real world durability testing in and working out the bugs before they throw it in such a high volume vehicle like the F150........if needed.

Just my thoughts. Who knows.

smurfs_of_war

True story there. I have a Ram with 1000lbs payload. It sucked when I saw that. Long, sordid story of miscommunication when I bought it- but that's for another time.
The EcoDiesel has been getting great response on the Ram forums for it's towing ability and grunt. Granted- it's a newcomer, but it seems to do as designed BUT... Ram seriously crippled it. The Hemi weighs less, granted, but the EcoDiesel has far less payload and towing capacity than a similar equipped Hemi offering- which is a bit baffling when you look at the ability. I know my Hemi man-handles my trailer (5600lbs) like it's not even there, but I also know that my payload is horrible and I replaced a few components to at least mechanically overcome that. Disappointed with that part, but the rest has been good. My F150 had available payload at least- but not much more (300lbs).
The Ram Express Models are coming with a max of 1800lbs payload (or so?) I believe- but that is a stripped out 4x2 with a Hemi. The EcoDiesel is about 400lbs less. So, for those who really watch the GVWR- it's a no go for towing unless you travel alone with an empty bladder, plain and simple. Really disappointing. For all that grunt and towing ability, it doesn't have the backbone to carry the tongue. You'll find way more axle weighers on the Ram forums than here