F150Torqued

Hey buddy, THAT phaser is not at Base Timing. The 5th finger should be pointing at the "L", See the two photos below.
http://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.f150...fb415586f.jpeg
http://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.f150...4c93a71106.jpg

F150Torqued

The photos I grabbed real quick - happen to be where the engine had been turned and the colored links are not lined up. But the important thing, look at pics all over this forum, the 5th finger is always pointing at the "L". I just checked my old one that I pulled off my engine.

oneofakinder

It wasnt that way when I installed the phasers, both of them were replaced at the same time. It seems to be stuck in that position, my "L" seems to be exactly where I left it when I installed. How does this move? and how do I move it back, is this what may be holding the valves open?

F150Torqued

I would not try to move it back. Yes thats what is causing low compression on that bank.

oneofakinder

I ordered everything from Rockauto, and they show a lifetime warranty on the phaser, so I should be able to get a new one for a little bit of shipping.

redfishtd

No offense- but you must follow svares final fix ,and understand it . It all starts With the crank dot at 6 oclock and no.1 at TDC . Then the cams decide whether its on the compression stroke or exhaust stroke, the chains lock it in .
But this is an interference engine . If you don't make sure by hand that there is no valve to piston contact for 2 revs you can bend a valve . You must do this last after you think its all good . Thats why I suggest lifting each cam so all valves are closed until you get the crank where you need it , then position the cams like the ford manual ,then torque them down ,then the chains will fine tune the timing . The marked links lock it in if you do it right .
Don't try to use some point on the crank pulley either . Its the dot on the crank gear . Don't confuse it with the keyway either .
Another helper that you both can read and agree on it will help. I find explaining it to others requires a more fuller understanding .
I really hope you avoid a bent valve . I know I sweated bullets over this when I did it . I still made some mistakes if I go back in I will change tensioners to the old metal ratcheting kind . plus I didn't clean out the vct housing .

redfishtd

The phasor is loosely locked to the cam by a pin it can vary it by a few degrees as it turns . By means of oil pressure and springs it can vary the lobes hit points by computer thereby changing when valves open . .
There is a direct relation ship between crank and cams , crank gear is much smaller than phasor gear . The phasor/cam takes 1 rev for 2 crank rev' s that's how you get 4 strokes . The cam then decides which valves to operate ,the computer /VCT/ oil pressure feed to phasor moving cam slightly varies this by a small amount for fuel performance/ emissions .
Timing is achieved by freezing this at one particular point namely no 1 cly tdc with cam lobes at the proper position, crank gear dot at six oclock .
Sorry if I confused you but there is a deeper explanation . But why go there if you basically get it . I simplified the operation without going to deep . Don't jump me guys .

F150Torqued

@oneofakinder this is a serious enough situation I did not want to mis speak - but it seemed to me like that phaser finger was "ADVANCED" with respect to the "L" gear mark, which should produce a disastrous situation - ie Valve contact. AND, your clock spring appears UNWOUND excessively - which would indicate cam timing toward ADVANCE, not retard with respect to the gear (Cam connected to finger plate & Bolt - gear is linked to Crankshaft). Certainly you cannot stand that many degrees of advance.


So I referred to my old phaser I had dissembled. And SURE ENOUGH. the plate containing the 5 fingers is held in place by 3 (rather small) position pins - with the center finger pointing at the "L" mark. That position represents base cam timing - of some unknown amount - but probably no more than 3º - 4º B4 TDC. Anything more than that (BY THE CAM ITSELF) will definitely contact pistons and destroy stuff. And according to your photo, the fifth finger is easily 45º advance. IMPOSSIBLE without totally crashing that engine. So I'm trying to figure out how that happened.


Stupid question. Is it possible you failed to Torque the bolt. It (in conjunction with those 3 flimsy little pins) holds the 5 finger plate to the front of the camshaft. If they strip off and that plate rotates - all bets are off. But the CAM is actually held in positioned by the large locating pin on the back of the phaser. So it would be possible for the front plate to move with respect to the cam and the guts of the phaser- whereby noting was seriously damaged. I HOPE HOPE.


But you are correct. The "L" on the gear not that far from where you would expect it if it were in time, chain wise.


SOMETHING bazar happened to that Phaser. - Are you sure that is FORD OEM, and Not DORMAN? I cannot tell by magnifying it if it has any markings on it at all. Mine had FOMOCO & a number stamped on the front.

oneofakinder

I used the cam gear locking tool to torque it, nothing moved there. This is the 5th one of these I have done, first one that has ever given me a problem. I remember the fingers being pointed exactly where it should have been, after many revolutions by hand it was still lined up exactly how it should have been. It isn't a dorman, it is the Standard S21001 cam phaser from RockAuto. Even with the hole in the valve cover, the truck still started up and moved on its own power, surprisingly with no codes stored per my Solus Edge scanner.

EBC-150

Yeah that phaser is definitely tweaked, something not right with it. You need to pull it to see if the pins or spring broke.