F150Torqued

@StephenG
IMHO, it is very doubtful that you could have a "noise" from a phaser problem above 1200 rpm. Chains / guides, very definitely. But phaser no.


The signature noise affectionately referred to as "phaser noise" originates from the spring loaded locking pin inside the phase slapping slack in when worn, broken or sloppy. In more severe cases, the phaser 'vanes' may be slapping the end of the chambers. Both situations develop when oil pressure (AT THE PHASER) sags to a point of equilibrium between the advance / retard side of the vanes within the phaser. HOWEVER, no matter how sorry your oil pressure might be at idle, I can assure you that above 1200 rpm it will be well above the point where those conditions can exist.


"RUMORS" have it that it requires 25 psi oil pressure at idle for phasers to work properly and not make noise. IDK ???? But since there are "restrictors" in the oil galleys in the heads reduce oil pressure in the heads --- and then 12 lash adjusters, four cam bearings/journals, a VCT solenoid without gaskets around the base, the phasers themselves, and chain tensioners all leaking a little pressure off, I have no idea what REAL pressure would exist at the phaser. But on my 5.4, oil pressure jumps to 45 to 50 by 800 or 900 rpms. And under a vast majority of driving conditions, the PCM begins to energize the VCT solenoids above 800 rpms and 25% engine load to 'retard the cams'. Noises after that point would almost have to be chains contacting the front cover or guides. Especially if they are broken into pieces laying all over the place like mine were.

BadFish523

@Tourqued thanks for telling me the bad news I guess lol. So I could still hear it in drive at a low rpm or would the load on the engine make the sound go away?

F150Torqued

Sounds are a little hard to verbalize, but the best description I have been able to come up with - my '04 5.4 started (about 125 - 150K) to sound almost exactly like a diesel when idling in drive. When accelerating to move forward, like in a drive-in window line, the sound would soften or disappear completely (at 750-800 rpms). In neutral, it would do likewise. Presumably because of the slight increase in oil pressure resulting from slight increase in rpm. But around 1000-1200 it would begin to sound more like "a bunch of marbles in a coffee can" if you shake it in a circular motion. (I suspect that was the cam chain getting against the timing cover. It had visual indication of such contact once it was removed, and both L & R chain guides were broken into numerous pieces. A couple of which were still laying in there with the chain dragging across them. The rest of them were in the pan. Take a look at the 6th photo on this post. http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/14...l#post16202872


But don't be discouraged about a timing job. It is not the end of the world, and the results can be most satisfying.


EDIT: This description completely ignores the infamous "TICK" which was coming from a lash adjuster or roller/follower - all of which I replaced at the same time. It now makes less noise than the Mercedes Benz parked next to me at the post office!!!!!

BadFish523

My biggest problem is I can't afford the 2500 quoted by my local Ford garage. Hope she lasts for a year till next tax season

BadFish523

Anybody think it'll be alright for a year?

F150Torqued

My crystal ball's busted. But these modular engines generally do not catastrophically fail because phaser issues. If you can stand the "rattle-trap" noises, poor gas mileage and performance, they'll just kinda keep chugging along.

BadFish523

Well I appreciate your help. Right now she runs fine. Average of 14mpg in town. Just a noise for now.

TOPGLOCK

No way would I give anyone $2500 to change out phasers/timing set. Where you located? If you were close I would most definitely show you the way. It's actually a piece of cake. Time and patience is all I needed. Oh yeah and tools too...

jackle61

Had a 5.4 that had the "Ford knock" and it took me to just under 300k, only got rid of the truck due to rust. Now I have a 5.0 that has the "Ford knock", not quite as loud but I'm not too worried about it. Great info to have. If I would have had it on my last truck I would have taken care of it right away, but 300k on a gas motor isn't bad.

Raging Forder

Okay, I did EVERYTHING this thread said, replaced everything including oil pump because when I got in there, the right side (passenger ) timing chain guide was shattered, so I cleaned oil pan, dip tube screen had a lot of plastic pieces and even some metal shavings which I believe came from timing chain cover. I changed spark plugs, etc. I started her up and she ran worse then when I started. Tracked it down to vct solenoid, replaced, and bam! Better! I drove her a little, running great, next day I got on the highway for a little cruise, drove for about an hour, I felt it miss and then a terrifying noise! Pulled over, shut it right down, checked it out. Got a tow home, tore her back down, (getting much quicker at this now ), cam phaser cracked and a roller puked out on left side (driver). So, do I try another phaser, if so, which brand? Or do I just drop my 5.0 from my old 88 Thunderbird in it, and is this basically, easily do able? I never had problems with that motor, was the 3rd owner, father in law was the second and it was always properly maintained. I have every oil change etc in a folder. I just bought this truck in January and am hemorrhaging money. This is my 3rd Ford truck, and I am losing faith because of this one. My old 94 F350 7.3 has 450,000 miles and outside of a few sensors and oil hoses in the past couple years, no problems. Any advice? Oh yah, this motor has 168, 000 miles. Still a young Un I thought.