The Final Repair Guide to 5.4 Cam Phaser Tick/Knock Sound
03-05-2015, 03:35 PM
#1881
Finally Got It!
FInally after a month, I have my 2004 F150 running like its supposed too! I ended up changing all the timing components and phasers. When that didnt work I put in Phaser Lockouts. Now it runs like a champ! Thanks again to everyone that replied and helped me, and to this thread!
03-05-2015, 04:12 PM
#1882
FInally after a month, I have my 2004 F150 running like its supposed too! I ended up changing all the timing components and phasers. When that didnt work I put in Phaser Lockouts. Now it runs like a champ! Thanks again to everyone that replied and helped me, and to this thread!
03-05-2015, 04:16 PM
#1883
Didnt have anymore pep to it but the fact that it idles now warm with no shaking and shuddering is worth it. I replaced my oil pump when I was in there but I didnt ever want to go back in there again. I don't know it was nesseccary or not though?
03-06-2015, 07:56 AM
#1884
03-06-2015, 09:22 PM
#1885
Ford Enthusiast
Hello Everyone,
Wow, what an excellent thread. First time poster here so figured I would just jump in. Unfortunately, I was hoping it would be a different thread other then this one.
I'm running into the same issue with my 2006 5.4 as well and have started a bit of work on it so far. Started bucking on me a few months ago and I thought for sure it was something to do with the transmission. My dad (who runs a body shop) said no, that is not the tranny. We ended up changing the spark plugs, didn't help. Went and got my codes read and the only one that came up orginally was the knock sensor. Changed that, no luck. Finally started getting the normal cam position, misfire...etc. codes. Finally just got to the point I could not drive it as it just kept bucking, misfiring all that fun stuff.
So far, we have changed out the VCT solenoids, cam position sensors, cam phasers. Did make the truck sound much better after the phasers where changed, but after we let the truck get warm, we were disappointed to hear the knock (or chain slap) back. Come to find out from reading this thread that it's probably the chain slapping inside. While we did the phasers, we didn't think of changing everything else while we were in there, wish we would have seen this thread before.
We are going to tear into it again the next couple of weeks. So, being we have changed the phasers, will we need to remove them again? I saw some other people posting that if you take them off, you need or should get new bolts again, is that correct? I'm not the best when it comes to the mechanic work, luckily my dad is pretty good with all this stuff. Also, we are going to get the chains, tensioners, all the normal stuff that everyone listed. Spoke with Ford here in Wichita about an oil pump and they said they have rarely sold any. I think while we are in there, we might as well get a new one in? I see people talk about the lashers quite a bit, is this something that should really be done, or I guess I'm not quite sure what they are or if we should go ahead and replace these or not?
Sorry for the long post, but just wanted to get out there what I have so far and see what you guys thought.
Thanks for the help!
Wow, what an excellent thread. First time poster here so figured I would just jump in. Unfortunately, I was hoping it would be a different thread other then this one.
I'm running into the same issue with my 2006 5.4 as well and have started a bit of work on it so far. Started bucking on me a few months ago and I thought for sure it was something to do with the transmission. My dad (who runs a body shop) said no, that is not the tranny. We ended up changing the spark plugs, didn't help. Went and got my codes read and the only one that came up orginally was the knock sensor. Changed that, no luck. Finally started getting the normal cam position, misfire...etc. codes. Finally just got to the point I could not drive it as it just kept bucking, misfiring all that fun stuff.
So far, we have changed out the VCT solenoids, cam position sensors, cam phasers. Did make the truck sound much better after the phasers where changed, but after we let the truck get warm, we were disappointed to hear the knock (or chain slap) back. Come to find out from reading this thread that it's probably the chain slapping inside. While we did the phasers, we didn't think of changing everything else while we were in there, wish we would have seen this thread before.
We are going to tear into it again the next couple of weeks. So, being we have changed the phasers, will we need to remove them again? I saw some other people posting that if you take them off, you need or should get new bolts again, is that correct? I'm not the best when it comes to the mechanic work, luckily my dad is pretty good with all this stuff. Also, we are going to get the chains, tensioners, all the normal stuff that everyone listed. Spoke with Ford here in Wichita about an oil pump and they said they have rarely sold any. I think while we are in there, we might as well get a new one in? I see people talk about the lashers quite a bit, is this something that should really be done, or I guess I'm not quite sure what they are or if we should go ahead and replace these or not?
Sorry for the long post, but just wanted to get out there what I have so far and see what you guys thought.
Thanks for the help!
No, to do the rest you do not have to remove the phasers again. Just open it up, remove the tone ring from the crank, remove the tensioners, remove guides and chains....install new parts. Ford did a updated oil pump when they supposedly fixed the phaser issues in the newer trucks.
03-07-2015, 07:02 PM
#1886
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Thank you for the help in this. We do have a few questions though. Is there anyway we could text or call someone to ask a few questions real quick? Wondering about when removing the front cover about the cams moving? Please let me know if someone might be available real quick.
Thank you all,
Tyson
Thank you all,
Tyson
03-08-2015, 05:02 AM
#1887
The cams won't move unless you move the crankshaft. They're connected with the timing chains.
03-08-2015, 05:25 AM
#1888
No, to do the rest you do not have to remove the phasers again. Just open it up, remove the tone ring from the crank, remove the tensioners, remove guides and chains....install new parts. Ford did a updated oil pump when they supposedly fixed the phaser issues in the newer trucks.
I would add that, I would drop that oil pan and check for bits of plastic from backside of Chain guides blocking the screen in the pump,
and obviously.. since your there, may as well replace that too now.
Good time for water pump also.
Mike
03-08-2015, 05:39 AM
#1889
Everyone I talked to claimed I had cam phaser noise. Learned a lot here, but no one mentioned anything about starting cold and having the dieseling noise.
I found a great article that explains why, and is exactly the symptoms I have.
Also goes onto explain how its misdiagnosed as cam phasers most of the time.
I have not got to tear mine down, but I do have the Code p0300 rich and lean essentially, and running like crap and sounding like a diesel from the get go, so am 99 percent positive that I have a broken guide on one side.
I had already ordered timing kit, along with oil pump, water pump, vcl solenoids, plugs, and a new intake for good measure. I am a firm believer that if I am there, I am doing it all. I'll buy lash adjusters and followers if needed upon pulling valve covers.
My bill for parts ordered total 712.03 so far.
Mike
http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/115
I found a great article that explains why, and is exactly the symptoms I have.
Also goes onto explain how its misdiagnosed as cam phasers most of the time.
I have not got to tear mine down, but I do have the Code p0300 rich and lean essentially, and running like crap and sounding like a diesel from the get go, so am 99 percent positive that I have a broken guide on one side.
I had already ordered timing kit, along with oil pump, water pump, vcl solenoids, plugs, and a new intake for good measure. I am a firm believer that if I am there, I am doing it all. I'll buy lash adjusters and followers if needed upon pulling valve covers.
My bill for parts ordered total 712.03 so far.
Mike
http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/115
Update on mine:
188k motor. Lower end looks like the day it ran off assembly line.
Guides mostly intact, bits broken off back lodged into oil pump pickup screen.
Phasers themselves obviously failed, but not busted up like most I have seen.
VCT Solenoid screens were mostly gone also.
Valve Lashers and cam followers looked good which I thought was insane for the mileage on it, and was expecting to have to replace them all.
Plugs were all pulled and all fairly fouled with gas. No issues and no breaks in removing them.
Dropping pan was a breeze, essentially just dropped the sway bar out of way and it came out with no issues within an hour. ( other then having to heat a bolt up )
Cannot proceed until I get a cam holding tool. ( I just cant bring myself to use vice grips )
I did have to get a few other parts that were not included with other parts that I had ordered. I bought a new oil pan gasket, as that was a leaky mess, and valve cover gaskets, VCT solenoid seals, and I did also replace a left rear brake caliper that was leaking.
I will be doing a fast flush after putting it all back together, as I do have just a small amount of sludge at front of motor in heads. Will be running it for maybe 20 minutes with some Seafoam, using old oil filter, before switching to Motorcraft filter and 5/20 Castrol.
I am assuming I may have a bad coil or 3 by what I saw from the plugs, but with bad cam phasers, You just cant guess until that's all buttoned up, and will go from there.
Mike
Last edited by Michael Johanson; 03-08-2015 at 05:47 AM.
03-08-2015, 02:53 PM
#1890
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Okay, we got timing chains on after changing everything and the final chain on the right side seems to still have some slack? We have not released the tab from the new tensioner. The left side is real tight, but not the right side? Any idea of what the issue may be or is this normal? Timing marks are all in the correct position.
Thanks again
Thanks again