2007 Expedition strange sound/vibration under light throttle
09-25-2016, 01:34 PM
#1
2007 Expedition strange sound/vibration under light throttle
If someone could just recognize this sound, I’d be on my way to fixing this low-grade but annoying issue. But after being listened to by four techs (two independents and two Ford franchise techs), none of that group had heard it before. This issue started the day I was on my way to a neighboring town to show the Expy to three sets of people interested in buying it (I’m going back to an F-150). But, of course, no-one wants to spring until it's fixed, and I can’t get it run down. So it’s time to unleash this issue onto the many brilliant minds of the forum. It sounds at first blush like a familiar one: a 2007 Expedition 5.4 Triton with a strange vibration/buzzing from what sounds like the front left-of-center when easing on to the gas at 40+ mph on level or a slight uphill. Mileage is 134K.
mp3 attached for your evaluation: in this clip, I am on a flat piece of road with just a slight uphill. I feather the throttle four times, for one or two seconds each time, and immediately ease off.
Thus far, I have ruled out the usual suspects:
1. IWEs. I tested with a vacuum pump, and both are fully operational, unlocking in the presence of vacuum and re-engaging when the vacuum is purged. I had previously replaced the solenoid when I noticed that the unit would not go into 4WD, and it fixed that problem, but that replacement did not affect the buzzing sound. The tech who rode with me said he was well familiar with the IWE issue and that it caused a much more violent grinding sound than this issue. Just to be sure, we switched into 4WD, and the problem persisted. I tested the check valves, and they’re fine.
2. Coil packs. Replaced all 8. No change. I should note that I ran both static and live data on my Innova 31603 with no findings. Should have done that before I bought the coil packs. Duh.
3. Plugs: the Ford tech took the position that absent any other issues with the truck’s performance, this could not be the problem. However, recognizing that plugs firing lean mixtures may still have issues, I also ran Mode 6 and did a live data run, and there are no misfires, even at the time of the noise. The truck performs beautifully otherwise, with great performance, no hesitation, flawless high-speed cruising and strong acceleration under load. If there’s a strong consensus here that takes opposition to the tech’s opinion, I don’t mind buying the plug extraction tool and giving it a shot, but with no misfire codes?
4. TC or TCC. Issue presents only on a slight uphill, ~40+ mph, with minimal feathering of the gas pedal. Dip into the pedal even a tiny fraction more and the noise/vibration stops. It cannot reliably be reproduced on a downhill, as speed increases too fast. According to the Ford tech, TCC and diff clutch pack issues would remain present on downhills, and have a more "washboard" sound.
5. All the heat shields are solid, with no looseness or missing fasteners. An inspection on the lift at the Ford franchise revealed nothing obvious that they could see.
I had hoped that the Ford tech would simply say “Oh yeah, I know that sound. I’ve seen/repaired this a dozen times, and it’s a common issue, and here’s what you do”. No such luck.
My next steps will be as follows, I think, unless you all have better insight:
1. Since the issue happens only with the slightest throttle pressure, it implies it may be a vacuum issue. When the pedal is pressed lightly, it’s briefly losing vacuum somewhere in the system. not sure why that would cause the noise, but I’ll hook up the Mityvac and test all the vacuum lines for leakdown.
2. Throttle body valve? IAC? EGR? I suppose it’s possible that the plate has developed a tiny bit of play, just enough to cause a metering issue with minimal throttle pressure.
3. Injectors?
I feel like I need to try and duplicate the problem with the Expy on a dyno, so I can at least locate the source of the noise, but of course, the location of the noise may not be the source of the issue. Grasping at straws here, guys and gals. What say you? Anyone recognize this sound and have a fix?
mp3 attached for your evaluation: in this clip, I am on a flat piece of road with just a slight uphill. I feather the throttle four times, for one or two seconds each time, and immediately ease off.
Thus far, I have ruled out the usual suspects:
1. IWEs. I tested with a vacuum pump, and both are fully operational, unlocking in the presence of vacuum and re-engaging when the vacuum is purged. I had previously replaced the solenoid when I noticed that the unit would not go into 4WD, and it fixed that problem, but that replacement did not affect the buzzing sound. The tech who rode with me said he was well familiar with the IWE issue and that it caused a much more violent grinding sound than this issue. Just to be sure, we switched into 4WD, and the problem persisted. I tested the check valves, and they’re fine.
2. Coil packs. Replaced all 8. No change. I should note that I ran both static and live data on my Innova 31603 with no findings. Should have done that before I bought the coil packs. Duh.
3. Plugs: the Ford tech took the position that absent any other issues with the truck’s performance, this could not be the problem. However, recognizing that plugs firing lean mixtures may still have issues, I also ran Mode 6 and did a live data run, and there are no misfires, even at the time of the noise. The truck performs beautifully otherwise, with great performance, no hesitation, flawless high-speed cruising and strong acceleration under load. If there’s a strong consensus here that takes opposition to the tech’s opinion, I don’t mind buying the plug extraction tool and giving it a shot, but with no misfire codes?
4. TC or TCC. Issue presents only on a slight uphill, ~40+ mph, with minimal feathering of the gas pedal. Dip into the pedal even a tiny fraction more and the noise/vibration stops. It cannot reliably be reproduced on a downhill, as speed increases too fast. According to the Ford tech, TCC and diff clutch pack issues would remain present on downhills, and have a more "washboard" sound.
5. All the heat shields are solid, with no looseness or missing fasteners. An inspection on the lift at the Ford franchise revealed nothing obvious that they could see.
I had hoped that the Ford tech would simply say “Oh yeah, I know that sound. I’ve seen/repaired this a dozen times, and it’s a common issue, and here’s what you do”. No such luck.
My next steps will be as follows, I think, unless you all have better insight:
1. Since the issue happens only with the slightest throttle pressure, it implies it may be a vacuum issue. When the pedal is pressed lightly, it’s briefly losing vacuum somewhere in the system. not sure why that would cause the noise, but I’ll hook up the Mityvac and test all the vacuum lines for leakdown.
2. Throttle body valve? IAC? EGR? I suppose it’s possible that the plate has developed a tiny bit of play, just enough to cause a metering issue with minimal throttle pressure.
3. Injectors?
I feel like I need to try and duplicate the problem with the Expy on a dyno, so I can at least locate the source of the noise, but of course, the location of the noise may not be the source of the issue. Grasping at straws here, guys and gals. What say you? Anyone recognize this sound and have a fix?
Last edited by dm05468; 09-25-2016 at 01:44 PM.
01-28-2019, 01:49 AM
#2
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Please share how did you fixed vibration maintaining speed.
If someone could just recognize this sound, I’d be on my way to fixing this low-grade but annoying issue. But after being listened to by four techs (two independents and two Ford franchise techs), none of that group had heard it before. This issue started the day I was on my way to a neighboring town to show the Expy to three sets of people interested in buying it (I’m going back to an F-150). But, of course, no-one wants to spring until it's fixed, and I can’t get it run down. So it’s time to unleash this issue onto the many brilliant minds of the forum. It sounds at first blush like a familiar one: a 2007 Expedition 5.4 Triton with a strange vibration/buzzing from what sounds like the front left-of-center when easing on to the gas at 40+ mph on level or a slight uphill. Mileage is 134K.
mp3 attached for your evaluation: in this clip, I am on a flat piece of road with just a slight uphill. I feather the throttle four times, for one or two seconds each time, and immediately ease off.
Thus far, I have ruled out the usual suspects:
1. IWEs. I tested with a vacuum pump, and both are fully operational, unlocking in the presence of vacuum and re-engaging when the vacuum is purged. I had previously replaced the solenoid when I noticed that the unit would not go into 4WD, and it fixed that problem, but that replacement did not affect the buzzing sound. The tech who rode with me said he was well familiar with the IWE issue and that it caused a much more violent grinding sound than this issue. Just to be sure, we switched into 4WD, and the problem persisted. I tested the check valves, and they’re fine.
2. Coil packs. Replaced all 8. No change. I should note that I ran both static and live data on my Innova 31603 with no findings. Should have done that before I bought the coil packs. Duh.
3. Plugs: the Ford tech took the position that absent any other issues with the truck’s performance, this could not be the problem. However, recognizing that plugs firing lean mixtures may still have issues, I also ran Mode 6 and did a live data run, and there are no misfires, even at the time of the noise. The truck performs beautifully otherwise, with great performance, no hesitation, flawless high-speed cruising and strong acceleration under load. If there’s a strong consensus here that takes opposition to the tech’s opinion, I don’t mind buying the plug extraction tool and giving it a shot, but with no misfire codes?
4. TC or TCC. Issue presents only on a slight uphill, ~40+ mph, with minimal feathering of the gas pedal. Dip into the pedal even a tiny fraction more and the noise/vibration stops. It cannot reliably be reproduced on a downhill, as speed increases too fast. According to the Ford tech, TCC and diff clutch pack issues would remain present on downhills, and have a more "washboard" sound.
5. All the heat shields are solid, with no looseness or missing fasteners. An inspection on the lift at the Ford franchise revealed nothing obvious that they could see.
I had hoped that the Ford tech would simply say “Oh yeah, I know that sound. I’ve seen/repaired this a dozen times, and it’s a common issue, and here’s what you do”. No such luck.
My next steps will be as follows, I think, unless you all have better insight:
1. Since the issue happens only with the slightest throttle pressure, it implies it may be a vacuum issue. When the pedal is pressed lightly, it’s briefly losing vacuum somewhere in the system. not sure why that would cause the noise, but I’ll hook up the Mityvac and test all the vacuum lines for leakdown.
2. Throttle body valve? IAC? EGR? I suppose it’s possible that the plate has developed a tiny bit of play, just enough to cause a metering issue with minimal throttle pressure.
3. Injectors?
I feel like I need to try and duplicate the problem with the Expy on a dyno, so I can at least locate the source of the noise, but of course, the location of the noise may not be the source of the issue. Grasping at straws here, guys and gals. What say you? Anyone recognize this sound and have a fix?
mp3 attached for your evaluation: in this clip, I am on a flat piece of road with just a slight uphill. I feather the throttle four times, for one or two seconds each time, and immediately ease off.
Thus far, I have ruled out the usual suspects:
1. IWEs. I tested with a vacuum pump, and both are fully operational, unlocking in the presence of vacuum and re-engaging when the vacuum is purged. I had previously replaced the solenoid when I noticed that the unit would not go into 4WD, and it fixed that problem, but that replacement did not affect the buzzing sound. The tech who rode with me said he was well familiar with the IWE issue and that it caused a much more violent grinding sound than this issue. Just to be sure, we switched into 4WD, and the problem persisted. I tested the check valves, and they’re fine.
2. Coil packs. Replaced all 8. No change. I should note that I ran both static and live data on my Innova 31603 with no findings. Should have done that before I bought the coil packs. Duh.
3. Plugs: the Ford tech took the position that absent any other issues with the truck’s performance, this could not be the problem. However, recognizing that plugs firing lean mixtures may still have issues, I also ran Mode 6 and did a live data run, and there are no misfires, even at the time of the noise. The truck performs beautifully otherwise, with great performance, no hesitation, flawless high-speed cruising and strong acceleration under load. If there’s a strong consensus here that takes opposition to the tech’s opinion, I don’t mind buying the plug extraction tool and giving it a shot, but with no misfire codes?
4. TC or TCC. Issue presents only on a slight uphill, ~40+ mph, with minimal feathering of the gas pedal. Dip into the pedal even a tiny fraction more and the noise/vibration stops. It cannot reliably be reproduced on a downhill, as speed increases too fast. According to the Ford tech, TCC and diff clutch pack issues would remain present on downhills, and have a more "washboard" sound.
5. All the heat shields are solid, with no looseness or missing fasteners. An inspection on the lift at the Ford franchise revealed nothing obvious that they could see.
I had hoped that the Ford tech would simply say “Oh yeah, I know that sound. I’ve seen/repaired this a dozen times, and it’s a common issue, and here’s what you do”. No such luck.
My next steps will be as follows, I think, unless you all have better insight:
1. Since the issue happens only with the slightest throttle pressure, it implies it may be a vacuum issue. When the pedal is pressed lightly, it’s briefly losing vacuum somewhere in the system. not sure why that would cause the noise, but I’ll hook up the Mityvac and test all the vacuum lines for leakdown.
2. Throttle body valve? IAC? EGR? I suppose it’s possible that the plate has developed a tiny bit of play, just enough to cause a metering issue with minimal throttle pressure.
3. Injectors?
I feel like I need to try and duplicate the problem with the Expy on a dyno, so I can at least locate the source of the noise, but of course, the location of the noise may not be the source of the issue. Grasping at straws here, guys and gals. What say you? Anyone recognize this sound and have a fix?
01-28-2019, 12:19 PM
#3
Mark
iTrader: (1)
01-28-2019, 06:35 PM
#4
He prob would have gotten more feedback had he posted in the 09+ section. Starting in 07’ the Expedition got the new ECM package and 6 speed trans with several other updates before the 09’ F-150s. Doesn’t share as much with an 07 F-150, closer related to the 09+ F-150. I don’t recognize the noise.
6 speeds had some issues in the early years with warn fluid causing shuddering. Often a trans flush fixed it.
6 speeds had some issues in the early years with warn fluid causing shuddering. Often a trans flush fixed it.
Last edited by ModularFord; 01-28-2019 at 06:39 PM.