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Old 10-14-2013, 11:56 AM   #1
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Default 2004 5.4 F150 with Rough Idle

I've got an 04 f150 SC with the 5.4. 2 weeks ago it starting idling rough and the CEL light came on. P0012 Intake Camshaft Position Timing Over-Retarded Bank 1 was the error code. I put on a new camshaft position sensor on pass side and still got the same CEL. Then I tried the VCT solenoid and that seemed to fix the CEL but it's still running rough at idle. It also has a throaty sound around 2500 RPM's. Sort of a deep sound of fuel building up. Again the check engine light is not on but I still feel it's idling rough and has a slight vibration to it.
Upon reading other forums it was suggested to clean the throttle body and MAF which I have also done and have the same results. The trucks got 135K and has never had the plugs changed. I'm a little gun shy pending one of the plugs will break off in the head. I checked for vacuum leaks but don't know if I was looking in the right area. Some guidance for that would be appreciated as well as other steps I need to take before getting bent over at the dealer.
Thanks in advance for your time,
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Old 10-14-2013, 12:11 PM   #2
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I hate to say it but it sounds exactly like what mine just did. Un plug the cam sensor and see if that smooths out the idle. If it does than it has most likely jumped time or you have a timing issue at the very least or at least that would my guess.
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Old 10-14-2013, 12:46 PM   #3
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What can be done if it jumped timing? Or how do I check to see if timing is running correctly? Sounds expensive if that's the case...
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Old 10-14-2013, 02:23 PM   #4
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Well talking to. Some of my buddy's who wrench for a living they say that if it has jumped time you need a new timing set. But if it is still drivable it could just need plugs or a throttle body cleaning
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Old 10-14-2013, 03:15 PM   #5
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The vehicle is still drive-able. I did clean the throttle body and noticed a slight gain in smoothness once I got pasted the idle - so I'm sure that did me SOME good. I'm not against changing the plugs, just hope that I don't break on off inside the head. Tonight I will pull each coil pack and see if the motor makes any difference while running. If it does then I'll know that cylinder is working. If it doesn't then maybe I can isolate the issue to that cylinder and come to the conclusion that it's either the coil pack or plug. I'm just surprised that I don't get a CEL for how rough it's idling.

If I do decide to change out the plugs is the process as simple as:

Remove PCM and harness on pass side to get to everything easier.
Pull Coil Pack and break free the spark plug 1/8 to 1/4 turn
Spray some PB Blaster down hole then wait an hour
Finally remove the spark plug with an impact at 60lbs

Also, I did pull the electrical plug on crankshaft position sensor while running and it make no difference for the idle miss.

Thanks,
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Old 10-14-2013, 09:50 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cornhusker View Post
The vehicle is still drive-able. I did clean the throttle body and noticed a slight gain in smoothness once I got pasted the idle - so I'm sure that did me SOME good. I'm not against changing the plugs, just hope that I don't break on off inside the head. Tonight I will pull each coil pack and see if the motor makes any difference while running. If it does then I'll know that cylinder is working. If it doesn't then maybe I can isolate the issue to that cylinder and come to the conclusion that it's either the coil pack or plug. I'm just surprised that I don't get a CEL for how rough it's idling. If I do decide to change out the plugs is the process as simple as: Remove PCM and harness on pass side to get to everything easier. Pull Coil Pack and break free the spark plug 1/8 to 1/4 turn Spray some PB Blaster down hole then wait an hour Finally remove the spark plug with an impact at 60lbs Also, I did pull the electrical plug on crankshaft position sensor while running and it make no difference for the idle miss. Thanks,
sounds like you have a broken phaser on that side, causing the whole bank to not fire correctly at idle,
Mine was doing this, I put some 10w-40 in the see if the increase in oil pressure was enough to overcome the spring on the broken phaser and it was, it worked for about a day and a half then it was back.

Telling me that is was a phaser issue, you will also want to verify your oil pressure by putting in a mechanical oil gauge.

This is what was causing my issue. Broken phaser vanes
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2004 5.4 F150 with Rough Idle-image-3567208538.jpg  
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Old 10-16-2013, 02:19 PM   #7
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While you were that far in did you replace chains and tensioners or did you not take the timing cover off and only do the phazer on that side?
Thanks
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Old 10-16-2013, 04:51 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by cornhusker View Post
While you were that far in did you replace chains and tensioners or did you not take the timing cover off and only do the phazer on that side? Thanks
i did the whole shabang, I had a new phaser fail within 3000 miles so I had to do it all over again and at that time installed the lockout kit.
If I were you guys I would check my lash adjusters an followers, I wish is would have
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Old 10-18-2013, 06:46 PM   #9
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I will do the plugs and post my results. Phasers and timing chain next if needed. Thanks for everyone's input.
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Old 10-18-2013, 06:56 PM   #10
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Unplug both VCT solenoids, if the rough idle goes away then you know that the problem is with the VCT system (Phasers, solenoids, oil pressure, it can be one of those or all of them)
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Old 10-18-2013, 06:56 PM
 
 
 
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