ymeski56

I understand your feelings completely. We're all hoping for the best outcome for you. Keep us updated. A lot of people are interested & following this.

Sako

I will call it a design flaw.

IMO, the reason it seems only to affect some and not others, is the fact that a lot of people buy a new truck or car and never check the oil or any other fluids. They just take it in for service at 5000 mile intervals or when the oil life % monitor gets low.

The members of this forum are not the avg joe. I know dozens of people with these trucks, and not one has admitted to checking the oil, some even after 3-4 years, they just take it in every 3-5000 miles and have it changed.

And while discussing this with the dealer, they admitted that probably none of their techs check the oil before servicing. They just dump the oil and change the filter. SO it is likely affecting far more than is realized.

swflford

I agree completely and said the same thing about 400 posts back

If Ford really wanted to analyze this issue they should instruct all service departments to capture and measure the oil coming out during change on these engines, or at least accurately check the oil and document before pulling the plug. Then they could get a real handle on how many of these trucks are actually suffering from this same condition.

packplantpath

I know all of then don't suffer from it. There are tons of oil analyses on bitog for this engine and after 3-5,000 miles most show acceptable levels of fuel dilution. But no way would I go over 5000 miles.

Mine has never has any noticeable dilution.

Tuner Boost

You nailed it. Most vehicle owners just drive and put fuel in and never open their hood for any reason. When a DIC message prompts service, they go to the dealer. Forums like this are where many come to learn more and get information not readily available, and IMHO members seem to be more hungry to learn and understand more about their vehicle in all ways. Tires, oil type, things to watch for and head off. No vehicle comes 100% perfect from the factory, and the cause of these issues is one flaw. Other than that these are amazing engines.....and I know it is difficult for those that have not been on the manufacturing end of this, but it is extremely difficult and at huge cost to correct even a minor flaw once a vehicle/engine has gone into production. the saying that a .02 part cost $200 million to change, is not far off. The Last brand new Ford diesel I bout was a 6.0.....and I lost all faith after have 1/2 dozen 7.3's through the years for pulling transport and race rigs and would have never sold the last one if I had a clue that spending $50k on the new 6.0 would have left us stuck on interstates missing key races, not being able to deliver a build on time, etc. and we ended up after giving Ford every chance possible, simply swapping in ARP head studs and fixing it our selves for no more issues. This is part of every mass produced vehicle. GM and the inexpensive ignition switch issue they had 8-10 years to fix and ignored it and passed it off waiting for it to go away, and now look.

It IS a design flaw, plain and simple and so well documented...especially when the results are so dramatic by those that have went outside of these TSB's and found the solution on their own.

Again I agree. I work directly with design and engineering, I tear these down and see first hand. I also work hand in hand with the dealer service departments...years with GM dealers on related issues with them, and recently now w/Ford with a SE dealer (large one) and a Midwest based one (smaller one) doing just as your suggesting, but capturing and measuring what is caught with the modified system, monitoring oil levels and oil analysis to see how effective this is as well as customer feedback from a few that have tried every Ford fix to no avail. And the accumulation is no longer occurring in the CAC, the fuel in the oil, and the shudder has disappeared on all so far. I know thats only a few actually where a Ford dealer is trying this now, but there are over 270 now that have dont it themselves or had there shop do the mod and they report that same. ALL the issues have disappeared and most are reporting back 2-3 MPG improvement as well. But I don't see Ford fixing the 3.5 as they are concentrating on the 2.7 right now (similar to how the 6.0 diesel was handled).

FordService

Hi jsp1960,

My offer to assist still stands; just reach out to me via private message (PM) with your full name, best daytime phone number, VIN, mileage, and servicing dealership so I can look into ways to help.

Crystal

jsp1960

Crystal

Thank you.

I will keep you informed if/when I get my truck back and may take you up on your offer.

Who are you anyway? And what is it that you could help out with?

Tyssa'sRide

TB nice write up. I hope you don't mind helping out here. I have very little time to read these posts, and I'm wondering what the "fix" is you are talking about. If it has put a stop to these issues I'm in! I don't mind putting a bit of time or $ into it, if it fixes things. Thanks for your time.

jsp1960

I just got this email from the service manager. What does this mean?
When all is said and done can I trust the truck?


"Sorry for the inconvenience Jeff.
We have been running some specific tests to determine the root cause of the fuel.
They are slow going, but it looks like we found something this morning.
Yesterday we ran the engine up to temp, then shut it down and removed the spark plugs. After removing the plugs we looked into the cylinders with a borescope to check for fuel, no fuel was found in the cylinders.
Next we drained the oil and let it sit overnight with the drain plug out. With the oil drained we then cycled the ignition so the High pressure fuel pump was on, then we waited several minute to see if fuel would run out of the oil pan drain. After several minutes we did have steady dripping that smelled of fuel. The engineers asked us to run this test and advised us to replace the HPFP if we had fuel draining. We have ordered a new pump assembly.
I will keep you posted, we may see the pump this week."

itguy08

It makes sense that it is the high pressure fuel pump. It sits in the valve cover and can leak fuel directly into the oil. Parts do fail and if it fixes the issue so the oil level doesn't rise I'd have no issues trusting the truck for long life.

For all we know, Ford could have gotten a bad batch of HPFPs. It has happened before with other manufacturers and even other parts on Fords. Unfortunately only Ford and their supplier are privy to that information.

This is one more reason I have a hard time with the theory that there are these huge inherent defects in this engine. You have one individual leading people down a path that does not apply in the majority of cases and everyone wants to scream "inherent defect" rather than get to the true root cause. That root cause can be one of many things which are not related in the slightest bit.