Crappy Air Conditioning-Has Anyone Thought About A Class Action Suit?
08-29-2014, 08:53 PM
#481
Senior Member
Since Ford monitors this post and website, there are things that I will be leaving out of these posts.
I believe at this point, that my warranty is in jeopardy and that ford has possibly noted this case with my vin of course and anyone else that comes along will see it. At this point, I don't think I will be able to escalate it further via Ford themselves. It will most likely take OTHER outside assistance!
08-29-2014, 08:59 PM
#482
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Me neither, what is really sad I, and proves that Ford is being spiteful, is that for all of the time and effort involved by everyone, it would have been cheaper to reclaim, evacuate my system and refill to ensure that it is properly charged!
But their pride and not being able to get to the right person is only costing more and causing mental anguish!
I really like all of their "standard form emails" and the way they ask you "what would you like to do"?
But their pride and not being able to get to the right person is only costing more and causing mental anguish!
I really like all of their "standard form emails" and the way they ask you "what would you like to do"?
I completely agree. Even after planning an evacuation and recharge through the customer service manager and dealer on my last visit, it did not happen. I now realize that I was lied to about it being done on my second visit as well.
It is a sad state of affairs, but it represents the direction that our countries have turned to. In this case, Ford should be embarrassed.
Take Care
Green Gem
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digitaltrucker (08-29-2014)
08-29-2014, 09:03 PM
#483
Senior Member
Thread Starter
At this point, even with my contact, I doubt I will be able to actually talk to someone.
Since Ford monitors this post and website, there are things that I will be leaving out of these posts.
I believe at this point, that my warranty is in jeopardy and that ford has possibly noted this case with my vin of course and anyone else that comes along will see it. At this point, I don't think I will be able to escalate it further via Ford themselves. It will most likely take OTHER outside assistance!
Since Ford monitors this post and website, there are things that I will be leaving out of these posts.
I believe at this point, that my warranty is in jeopardy and that ford has possibly noted this case with my vin of course and anyone else that comes along will see it. At this point, I don't think I will be able to escalate it further via Ford themselves. It will most likely take OTHER outside assistance!
Good Luck
Green Gem
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digitaltrucker (08-29-2014)
08-29-2014, 11:29 PM
#484
Senior Member
Only if there is a problem with the blend door or plenum.
Last edited by All Hat No Cattle; 08-30-2014 at 10:10 PM.
08-30-2014, 02:23 AM
#485
It would aid in the diag but not exactly pinpoint the problem, I've seen busted blend doors that would allow the actuator to move into what ever position it was commanded by the module and show it working as designed.
One of those times where partial to full dash removal may be required to diag further.
Sensor readings, module readings, harness tests, it's not your 1970 average climate control system.
No cut and dry way to say what the problem is without in-depth diag on several levels. I remember one instance where the plastic used for the plenum was inferior from the maker due to someone in Mexico trying to skate by for profit, wound up costing Ford an assload to repair because the entire plenum had to be replaced, I think it was for either the Taurus or Contour, and the Mercury counterparts.
I only remember because I had to replace dozens of them, warranty paid 4 hrs, 1st time took most of us 7 hrs, but after a few we were able to shave the time worked to match the pay.
.
Last edited by RLXXI; 08-30-2014 at 02:34 AM.
08-30-2014, 07:09 AM
#486
Senior Member
Thread Starter
If the issue was the blend door, would it not affect the air flow from the vents and push air out the wrong openings too?
Only once since owning my truck (purchased in September 2012) have I heard the blend door move. It was last winter and it made an audible clunk.
When I use the truck's heater, it will drive me out of the truck at full output. Even in minus 35F temperatures, and after warming the truck up inside (five to ten minutes), it gets cut back to about half of its heating capacity. If it can heat that cab volume that fast, should it not be able to cool the same volume in about the same time?
What can I do to check the blend door operation? It involves more than checking A/C pressures and refrigerant levels, so the dealers will never do it.
Thanks
Green Gem
Only once since owning my truck (purchased in September 2012) have I heard the blend door move. It was last winter and it made an audible clunk.
When I use the truck's heater, it will drive me out of the truck at full output. Even in minus 35F temperatures, and after warming the truck up inside (five to ten minutes), it gets cut back to about half of its heating capacity. If it can heat that cab volume that fast, should it not be able to cool the same volume in about the same time?
What can I do to check the blend door operation? It involves more than checking A/C pressures and refrigerant levels, so the dealers will never do it.
Thanks
Green Gem
08-30-2014, 07:56 AM
#487
Senior Member
Thread Starter
My new post Re: Ford Customer Service
https://www.f150forum.com/f38/ford-c...4/#post3676428
Green Gem
https://www.f150forum.com/f38/ford-c...4/#post3676428
Green Gem
08-30-2014, 08:54 AM
#488
Senior Member
Summation of My Hijack of this thread so others do not have to read the whole thing:
2013 Ford SC F150 15K miles
Complaint: Poor AC performance during heat of day
1.) Took to dealer, dealer said within specs
2.) Complained to management at dealer, refer to Service Manager
3.) Discuss with him, was told upon next vist on hot day, truck ac would be recliamned, evacuated and recharged with fresh R134A
4.) Took Back to dealer and met with Service Manager and took him for ride in vehicle
5.) Service Manager expressed concern about how the ac was cycling wanted to take back in shop so I allowed
6.) was told they were contacting Ford Engineers for assistance, requested they involve Ford Reps the next day via email
7.) Reached out to Ford CS folks here, they admitted they were limited on their efforts and all they could do was suggest a second opinion or escalate.
8.) Attempted to contact owner of dealership, GM would not give info nor would Ford. Info obtained and info sent: No Response
9.) FILED COMPLAINTS AT FORD.COM FOR INFO OF OWNER AND SERVICE ISSUE
10.) Received, what I thought was a promising email from the alleged next level of Ford support to assist. Said I would be contacted by dealer SM or Ford Rep. I responded that due to being lied to by the SM at Joe Myers Ford in Houston, I would rather go elsewhere and be contacted by Ford Rep to resolve this
11.) Friday August 28, 2014 received email, no contact call or previous email nor did they review truck, saying they sided with dealer and if I wanted to, I could go to another dealer.
There you have it! I have a 40K truck in Houston, Texas purchased from Joe Myers Ford (Do not Recommend based on my experiences), that cannot be used because on a 95 degree day the ac only blows 48-50 degree air. Apparently many others with this same truck, see better results and have no issues, but some have very similar issues. It is believed that, based on others report about going to dealers, that Ford is intentionally shorting these systems of Freon at the time of build. Since Ford refuses to evacuate these systems, which could prove either way, we will never know unless we go outside the Ford system which could void your warranty.
The dealer would not honor, now would Ford require them to honor, their suggestion to reclaim the system in order to guarantee proper charge and no contamination.
So at this point my options are:
1.) Forget about it, Ford always wins and park the truck!
2.) Pay to have the work done then when a deficiency is found seek reimbursement from Ford as other have suggested
3.) Trade the truck
4.) Hire an Attorney experienced in this type product issues.
Please note that, FORD will always end their emails to you with "PLease advise what you would like to do"! They do this so you cant say that they are in violation of not honoring your warranty, even though they will not take the next step. None of us know what is in Ford Computers so even if I did go to another dealer, they may already be instructed to do nothing and advise the system is fixed.
Ford wont explain why my Wife's Edge 2013 and my Sons Explorer 2014, all have 39 degree air constantly!
2013 Ford SC F150 15K miles
Complaint: Poor AC performance during heat of day
1.) Took to dealer, dealer said within specs
2.) Complained to management at dealer, refer to Service Manager
3.) Discuss with him, was told upon next vist on hot day, truck ac would be recliamned, evacuated and recharged with fresh R134A
4.) Took Back to dealer and met with Service Manager and took him for ride in vehicle
5.) Service Manager expressed concern about how the ac was cycling wanted to take back in shop so I allowed
6.) was told they were contacting Ford Engineers for assistance, requested they involve Ford Reps the next day via email
7.) Reached out to Ford CS folks here, they admitted they were limited on their efforts and all they could do was suggest a second opinion or escalate.
8.) Attempted to contact owner of dealership, GM would not give info nor would Ford. Info obtained and info sent: No Response
9.) FILED COMPLAINTS AT FORD.COM FOR INFO OF OWNER AND SERVICE ISSUE
10.) Received, what I thought was a promising email from the alleged next level of Ford support to assist. Said I would be contacted by dealer SM or Ford Rep. I responded that due to being lied to by the SM at Joe Myers Ford in Houston, I would rather go elsewhere and be contacted by Ford Rep to resolve this
11.) Friday August 28, 2014 received email, no contact call or previous email nor did they review truck, saying they sided with dealer and if I wanted to, I could go to another dealer.
There you have it! I have a 40K truck in Houston, Texas purchased from Joe Myers Ford (Do not Recommend based on my experiences), that cannot be used because on a 95 degree day the ac only blows 48-50 degree air. Apparently many others with this same truck, see better results and have no issues, but some have very similar issues. It is believed that, based on others report about going to dealers, that Ford is intentionally shorting these systems of Freon at the time of build. Since Ford refuses to evacuate these systems, which could prove either way, we will never know unless we go outside the Ford system which could void your warranty.
The dealer would not honor, now would Ford require them to honor, their suggestion to reclaim the system in order to guarantee proper charge and no contamination.
So at this point my options are:
1.) Forget about it, Ford always wins and park the truck!
2.) Pay to have the work done then when a deficiency is found seek reimbursement from Ford as other have suggested
3.) Trade the truck
4.) Hire an Attorney experienced in this type product issues.
Please note that, FORD will always end their emails to you with "PLease advise what you would like to do"! They do this so you cant say that they are in violation of not honoring your warranty, even though they will not take the next step. None of us know what is in Ford Computers so even if I did go to another dealer, they may already be instructed to do nothing and advise the system is fixed.
Ford wont explain why my Wife's Edge 2013 and my Sons Explorer 2014, all have 39 degree air constantly!
Last edited by digitaltrucker; 08-30-2014 at 10:05 AM.
08-30-2014, 09:32 AM
#489
I had one on my 2002 Powerstroke, bought it from an on line reseller. Popular mod in the day. It was vacuum operated, no need to do anything under the hood. And it worked.
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Green Gem (08-30-2014)
08-30-2014, 12:04 PM
#490
Answers inline:
If the issue was the blend door, would it not affect the air flow from the vents and push air out the wrong openings too?
No, there are several doors inside the plenum that direct air flow to where you set the control unit, blend door as the name suggests simply separates the heater core from the evaporator core and all points in between to blend the air temperature coming out of the plenum to the desired mix.
Only once since owning my truck (purchased in September 2012) have I heard the blend door move. It was last winter and it made an audible clunk.
Normally you will not hear any door open or close except perhaps the door that closes outside air intake to recirculate the cabin air. Then it's only a change in pitch from the fan motor, eg: sounds like it speeds up or down.
When I use the truck's heater, it will drive me out of the truck at full output. Even in minus 35F temperatures, and after warming the truck up inside (five to ten minutes), it gets cut back to about half of its heating capacity. If it can heat that cab volume that fast, should it not be able to cool the same volume in about the same time?
Technically yes but not really, you would have to understand how thermal properties between hot/cold react to each other, when you turn your a/c on you are not actually blowing cold air, what you are feeling is the hot air rushing to the cold air in an attempt to heat it up. That one still has me scratching my head, but that's how it was explained to me by my instructor.
What can I do to check the blend door operation? It involves more than checking A/C pressures and refrigerant levels, so the dealers will never do it.
Nothing you can do to check other than perhaps feed a bore scope wand into the plenum to physically look at the door to see if it is opening and closing all the way.
The temperature blend door actuator feedback resistor is supplied a ground from the HVAC module and a 5-volt reference voltage on the temperature blend door actuator reference circuits. The HVAC module reads the voltage on the temperature blend door actuator feedback circuits to determine the temperature blend door actuator position by the position of the actuator feedback resistor wiper arm.
During an actuator calibration cycle, the HVAC module drives the temperature blend door until the door reaches both internal stops in the HVAC case. If the temperature blend door is temporarily obstructed or binding during a calibration cycle, the HVAC module may interpret this as the actual end of travel for the door. When this condition occurs and the HVAC module commands the actuator to it's end of travel, the airflow temperature may not be as warm or cold as expected.
Thanks
Green Gem
No, there are several doors inside the plenum that direct air flow to where you set the control unit, blend door as the name suggests simply separates the heater core from the evaporator core and all points in between to blend the air temperature coming out of the plenum to the desired mix.
Only once since owning my truck (purchased in September 2012) have I heard the blend door move. It was last winter and it made an audible clunk.
Normally you will not hear any door open or close except perhaps the door that closes outside air intake to recirculate the cabin air. Then it's only a change in pitch from the fan motor, eg: sounds like it speeds up or down.
When I use the truck's heater, it will drive me out of the truck at full output. Even in minus 35F temperatures, and after warming the truck up inside (five to ten minutes), it gets cut back to about half of its heating capacity. If it can heat that cab volume that fast, should it not be able to cool the same volume in about the same time?
Technically yes but not really, you would have to understand how thermal properties between hot/cold react to each other, when you turn your a/c on you are not actually blowing cold air, what you are feeling is the hot air rushing to the cold air in an attempt to heat it up. That one still has me scratching my head, but that's how it was explained to me by my instructor.
What can I do to check the blend door operation? It involves more than checking A/C pressures and refrigerant levels, so the dealers will never do it.
Nothing you can do to check other than perhaps feed a bore scope wand into the plenum to physically look at the door to see if it is opening and closing all the way.
The temperature blend door actuator feedback resistor is supplied a ground from the HVAC module and a 5-volt reference voltage on the temperature blend door actuator reference circuits. The HVAC module reads the voltage on the temperature blend door actuator feedback circuits to determine the temperature blend door actuator position by the position of the actuator feedback resistor wiper arm.
During an actuator calibration cycle, the HVAC module drives the temperature blend door until the door reaches both internal stops in the HVAC case. If the temperature blend door is temporarily obstructed or binding during a calibration cycle, the HVAC module may interpret this as the actual end of travel for the door. When this condition occurs and the HVAC module commands the actuator to it's end of travel, the airflow temperature may not be as warm or cold as expected.
Thanks
Green Gem
Last edited by RLXXI; 08-30-2014 at 12:07 PM.