Acceleration shudder diagnosed by Ford!
07-25-2014, 10:31 AM
#381
Senior Member
It was the low to mid $300's.. really not bad. I cant remember exactly. I thought I was gonna get screwed and have to drop close to a grand! The aftermarket aluminum one cost me $700.
No, new shaft not from Ford parts directly.. I took my truck into a place called Pro Gear here in San Diego. Pro Gear's supplier told us on the phone (while I was standing there) that Ford had recently dropped prices significantly on this item.
I'm guessing Ford is trying to unload parts in anticipation of the 2015's ???
I'm also guessing we are talking about two different things on this thread. Slip-yoke clunk and axle shudder.. I dont have the leaf spring or pinion angle issue. I have a Snugtop on my bed and I think that may help me a bit with the added weight. Plus, I changed out the crummy OEM shocks.
No, new shaft not from Ford parts directly.. I took my truck into a place called Pro Gear here in San Diego. Pro Gear's supplier told us on the phone (while I was standing there) that Ford had recently dropped prices significantly on this item.
I'm guessing Ford is trying to unload parts in anticipation of the 2015's ???
I'm also guessing we are talking about two different things on this thread. Slip-yoke clunk and axle shudder.. I dont have the leaf spring or pinion angle issue. I have a Snugtop on my bed and I think that may help me a bit with the added weight. Plus, I changed out the crummy OEM shocks.
Last edited by RESQLAB; 07-25-2014 at 10:42 AM.
07-25-2014, 10:56 AM
#382
IT nerd geek DORK NERD
I'm betting you're right. As of right now, I'm blessed to have neither issue (I've just got the 55mph shuddering with the 5.0 - I'm convinced it's just a cheesy torque converter paired with a hypermiling ECU flash - lol; also have the super sprung rear suspension) but if I ever DO have that issue at least I know it's not super expensive.
Of course, if the 2015's fix this issue - and I get approval from the Missus - I'll just sell it outright and trade on a '15.
Of course, if the 2015's fix this issue - and I get approval from the Missus - I'll just sell it outright and trade on a '15.
08-19-2014, 07:50 PM
#383
Neophyte
Here is an update on the axle wrap/pinion angle ford foo. I pull a 27' TT and sometime load the truck to the MAX. Like 3 dirt bikes, generator, canoe, bicycles, firewood, 5 passengers, etc. I also have a 12" long hitch so I can drop the bed wile towing the TT.
The maxtow/HD package upgrades were definitely needed for my use.
I had the take off shudder real bad. It was scarey bad when going up hill from a stop when fully loaded - like holy crap she is going to blow kinda of shaking. Got my wife and kids in there and part of the reason I bought a NEW truck was for everyones safety - and now this! I've been misled/taken - an unhappy camper to say the least.
Of course I went to my FORD dealer where I bought the truck and said WTF? I just dropped some serious coin on this rig and its shaking like its coming apart - can you
fix it please?
So, there is a service bulletin where you can set the pinion angle based on average use. At first the service manager played dumb and said I need to bring in the truck loaded with everything in it so it could be diagnosed. So I threw down the BS card and said give me a day/time. Then he said it was impractical to diagnose, where would we put all my stuff while they worked on it. Then the service manager said "Thats an uncommon use of the truck to run loaded sometimes and empty sometimes". Then he even refused to set up an appointment.
Hugh? What? Running the truck loaded to within specification and unloaded is AN UNCOMMON USE? It hurts me to even write this. I could easily get a friggin stroke or seizure just repeating that non-sense. Or maybe your claimed load numbers are overstated? You guys that sued/complained - awesome.
But I do like my truck and just because the FORD dealer is a friggin cheese eating DORK doesn't change the fact that my truck IS one of the best looking trucks ever
made on the planet, with a great ride, and out does every other truck out there in many ways....
SO, after reading this thread and talking to suspension shops and other stuff decided to try the airbags. I had these on my other truck and liked them alot. Also, my read on the problem was a little different than DCFLUID, or maybe that my truck is diffferent and behaved a little differently. I have the HD package which has some stiffer leafs already.
Again, my take is that the problem is pinion angle related (with some wrap reality).
I bought a device to measure the pinion angle.
Unloaded the truck measures about 4 degrees negative pinion angle. When I put the trailer on the hitch, that decreases to about 1.8 degrees. Unfortunately I did not get to make a measurement with the bed was loaded with toys but its likely that the pinion angle actually goes positive! Gasing it from a stop increases the pinion angle even more and eventually (I think) starts binding up the u-joint and also axle wrapping that creates the shaking thats the problem. So, I think both the pinion angle and axle wrap add up to creating the problem. I think that the positive pinion angle contributes to additional torque making the wrap even worse that it is. Reason I think this is because depending on how much weight is in the bed of the truck, the amount of shaking changes quite a bit. MORE than what would be expected from just the weight and the accompanying torque stresses from accelerating it. In other words, the same additional weight in the trailer doesn't have the same effect as it does in the bed.
Adding the airbags let me increase the pinion angle back to -3.8 degrees, and *nearly* eliminated the shake on my acid test course. The test course/setup was my fully loaded rig pulling into in-n-out burger in placerville. Up hill from a stop. This was a total fail without airbags and *nearly* eliminated with the air bags. So there you have it.
Sorry, no fix for the cheese eating FORD dealer dorkheads - but airbags do make enough of an improvement that I won't break my truck pulling into in-n-out next time.
The maxtow/HD package upgrades were definitely needed for my use.
I had the take off shudder real bad. It was scarey bad when going up hill from a stop when fully loaded - like holy crap she is going to blow kinda of shaking. Got my wife and kids in there and part of the reason I bought a NEW truck was for everyones safety - and now this! I've been misled/taken - an unhappy camper to say the least.
Of course I went to my FORD dealer where I bought the truck and said WTF? I just dropped some serious coin on this rig and its shaking like its coming apart - can you
fix it please?
So, there is a service bulletin where you can set the pinion angle based on average use. At first the service manager played dumb and said I need to bring in the truck loaded with everything in it so it could be diagnosed. So I threw down the BS card and said give me a day/time. Then he said it was impractical to diagnose, where would we put all my stuff while they worked on it. Then the service manager said "Thats an uncommon use of the truck to run loaded sometimes and empty sometimes". Then he even refused to set up an appointment.
Hugh? What? Running the truck loaded to within specification and unloaded is AN UNCOMMON USE? It hurts me to even write this. I could easily get a friggin stroke or seizure just repeating that non-sense. Or maybe your claimed load numbers are overstated? You guys that sued/complained - awesome.
But I do like my truck and just because the FORD dealer is a friggin cheese eating DORK doesn't change the fact that my truck IS one of the best looking trucks ever
made on the planet, with a great ride, and out does every other truck out there in many ways....
SO, after reading this thread and talking to suspension shops and other stuff decided to try the airbags. I had these on my other truck and liked them alot. Also, my read on the problem was a little different than DCFLUID, or maybe that my truck is diffferent and behaved a little differently. I have the HD package which has some stiffer leafs already.
Again, my take is that the problem is pinion angle related (with some wrap reality).
I bought a device to measure the pinion angle.
Unloaded the truck measures about 4 degrees negative pinion angle. When I put the trailer on the hitch, that decreases to about 1.8 degrees. Unfortunately I did not get to make a measurement with the bed was loaded with toys but its likely that the pinion angle actually goes positive! Gasing it from a stop increases the pinion angle even more and eventually (I think) starts binding up the u-joint and also axle wrapping that creates the shaking thats the problem. So, I think both the pinion angle and axle wrap add up to creating the problem. I think that the positive pinion angle contributes to additional torque making the wrap even worse that it is. Reason I think this is because depending on how much weight is in the bed of the truck, the amount of shaking changes quite a bit. MORE than what would be expected from just the weight and the accompanying torque stresses from accelerating it. In other words, the same additional weight in the trailer doesn't have the same effect as it does in the bed.
Adding the airbags let me increase the pinion angle back to -3.8 degrees, and *nearly* eliminated the shake on my acid test course. The test course/setup was my fully loaded rig pulling into in-n-out burger in placerville. Up hill from a stop. This was a total fail without airbags and *nearly* eliminated with the air bags. So there you have it.
Sorry, no fix for the cheese eating FORD dealer dorkheads - but airbags do make enough of an improvement that I won't break my truck pulling into in-n-out next time.
The following users liked this post:
LIExpy (10-07-2014)
08-19-2014, 08:11 PM
#384
Here is an update on the axle wrap/pinion angle ford foo. I pull a 27' TT and sometime load the truck to the MAX. Like 3 dirt bikes, generator, canoe, bicycles, firewood, 5 passengers, etc. I also have a 12" long hitch so I can drop the bed wile towing the TT.
The maxtow/HD package upgrades were definitely needed for my use.
I had the take off shudder real bad. It was scarey bad when going up hill from a stop when fully loaded - like holy crap she is going to blow kinda of shaking. Got my wife and kids in there and part of the reason I bought a NEW truck was for everyones safety - and now this! I've been misled/taken - an unhappy camper to say the least.
Of course I went to my FORD dealer where I bought the truck and said WTF? I just dropped some serious coin on this rig and its shaking like its coming apart - can you
fix it please?
So, there is a service bulletin where you can set the pinion angle based on average use. At first the service manager played dumb and said I need to bring in the truck loaded with everything in it so it could be diagnosed. So I threw down the BS card and said give me a day/time. Then he said it was impractical to diagnose, where would we put all my stuff while they worked on it. Then the service manager said "Thats an uncommon use of the truck to run loaded sometimes and empty sometimes". Then he even refused to set up an appointment.
Hugh? What? Running the truck loaded to within specification and unloaded is AN UNCOMMON USE? It hurts me to even write this. I could easily get a friggin stroke or seizure just repeating that non-sense. Or maybe your claimed load numbers are overstated? You guys that sued/complained - awesome.
But I do like my truck and just because the FORD dealer is a friggin cheese eating DORK doesn't change the fact that my truck IS one of the best looking trucks ever
made on the planet, with a great ride, and out does every other truck out there in many ways....
SO, after reading this thread and talking to suspension shops and other stuff decided to try the airbags. I had these on my other truck and liked them alot. Also, my read on the problem was a little different than DCFLUID, or maybe that my truck is diffferent and behaved a little differently. I have the HD package which has some stiffer leafs already.
Again, my take is that the problem is pinion angle related (with some wrap reality).
I bought a device to measure the pinion angle.
Unloaded the truck measures about 4 degrees negative pinion angle. When I put the trailer on the hitch, that decreases to about 1.8 degrees. Unfortunately I did not get to make a measurement with the bed was loaded with toys but its likely that the pinion angle actually goes positive! Gasing it from a stop increases the pinion angle even more and eventually (I think) starts binding up the u-joint and also axle wrapping that creates the shaking thats the problem. So, I think both the pinion angle and axle wrap add up to creating the problem. I think that the positive pinion angle contributes to additional torque making the wrap even worse that it is. Reason I think this is because depending on how much weight is in the bed of the truck, the amount of shaking changes quite a bit. MORE than what would be expected from just the weight and the accompanying torque stresses from accelerating it. In other words, the same additional weight in the trailer doesn't have the same effect as it does in the bed.
Adding the airbags let me increase the pinion angle back to -3.8 degrees, and *nearly* eliminated the shake on my acid test course. The test course/setup was my fully loaded rig pulling into in-n-out burger in placerville. Up hill from a stop. This was a total fail without airbags and *nearly* eliminated with the air bags. So there you have it.
Sorry, no fix for the cheese eating FORD dealer dorkheads - but airbags do make enough of an improvement that I won't break my truck pulling into in-n-out next time.
The maxtow/HD package upgrades were definitely needed for my use.
I had the take off shudder real bad. It was scarey bad when going up hill from a stop when fully loaded - like holy crap she is going to blow kinda of shaking. Got my wife and kids in there and part of the reason I bought a NEW truck was for everyones safety - and now this! I've been misled/taken - an unhappy camper to say the least.
Of course I went to my FORD dealer where I bought the truck and said WTF? I just dropped some serious coin on this rig and its shaking like its coming apart - can you
fix it please?
So, there is a service bulletin where you can set the pinion angle based on average use. At first the service manager played dumb and said I need to bring in the truck loaded with everything in it so it could be diagnosed. So I threw down the BS card and said give me a day/time. Then he said it was impractical to diagnose, where would we put all my stuff while they worked on it. Then the service manager said "Thats an uncommon use of the truck to run loaded sometimes and empty sometimes". Then he even refused to set up an appointment.
Hugh? What? Running the truck loaded to within specification and unloaded is AN UNCOMMON USE? It hurts me to even write this. I could easily get a friggin stroke or seizure just repeating that non-sense. Or maybe your claimed load numbers are overstated? You guys that sued/complained - awesome.
But I do like my truck and just because the FORD dealer is a friggin cheese eating DORK doesn't change the fact that my truck IS one of the best looking trucks ever
made on the planet, with a great ride, and out does every other truck out there in many ways....
SO, after reading this thread and talking to suspension shops and other stuff decided to try the airbags. I had these on my other truck and liked them alot. Also, my read on the problem was a little different than DCFLUID, or maybe that my truck is diffferent and behaved a little differently. I have the HD package which has some stiffer leafs already.
Again, my take is that the problem is pinion angle related (with some wrap reality).
I bought a device to measure the pinion angle.
Unloaded the truck measures about 4 degrees negative pinion angle. When I put the trailer on the hitch, that decreases to about 1.8 degrees. Unfortunately I did not get to make a measurement with the bed was loaded with toys but its likely that the pinion angle actually goes positive! Gasing it from a stop increases the pinion angle even more and eventually (I think) starts binding up the u-joint and also axle wrapping that creates the shaking thats the problem. So, I think both the pinion angle and axle wrap add up to creating the problem. I think that the positive pinion angle contributes to additional torque making the wrap even worse that it is. Reason I think this is because depending on how much weight is in the bed of the truck, the amount of shaking changes quite a bit. MORE than what would be expected from just the weight and the accompanying torque stresses from accelerating it. In other words, the same additional weight in the trailer doesn't have the same effect as it does in the bed.
Adding the airbags let me increase the pinion angle back to -3.8 degrees, and *nearly* eliminated the shake on my acid test course. The test course/setup was my fully loaded rig pulling into in-n-out burger in placerville. Up hill from a stop. This was a total fail without airbags and *nearly* eliminated with the air bags. So there you have it.
Sorry, no fix for the cheese eating FORD dealer dorkheads - but airbags do make enough of an improvement that I won't break my truck pulling into in-n-out next time.
08-21-2014, 11:44 AM
#385
I use overloads and recommend them for hard worker F150's U bet !
10-02-2014, 04:48 PM
#386
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: weymouth, mass
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Acceleration shudder lives on !
Hi, I am new to the forum. I purchased a 2013 F-150 screw Lariat 157 " WB with 3.73 elect lock, max trailer tow, hd tires, elect camper mirrors, 4X4, and custom cab high cap, and 7700 gvwr pkg.
The truck started to shudder almost right away. It has gotten worse with more mileage, which is now only 3,740 miles. It has been back to the dealer six times already!
It shuddered from 1700 rpm to 2700rpm until 3000 miles and now it is 1100 rpm to 2000rpm. It is low when empty, and becomes greater as I put weight in the bed, or people in the cab , or tow a trailer. My big trailer, a sprinter 277 camper is 33 feet and 9000 lbs, shakes so bad that my ice coffee in the console cup spills its contents.
Ford is at a loss as to what can be done to solve this.
I really enjoyed reading your sollutions, and am going to try the add a leaf idea first I believe. Thanks everyone !!
The truck started to shudder almost right away. It has gotten worse with more mileage, which is now only 3,740 miles. It has been back to the dealer six times already!
It shuddered from 1700 rpm to 2700rpm until 3000 miles and now it is 1100 rpm to 2000rpm. It is low when empty, and becomes greater as I put weight in the bed, or people in the cab , or tow a trailer. My big trailer, a sprinter 277 camper is 33 feet and 9000 lbs, shakes so bad that my ice coffee in the console cup spills its contents.
Ford is at a loss as to what can be done to solve this.
I really enjoyed reading your sollutions, and am going to try the add a leaf idea first I believe. Thanks everyone !!
10-02-2014, 05:00 PM
#387
Your Ad Here
Hi, I am new to the forum. I purchased a 2013 F-150 screw Lariat 157 " WB with 3.73 elect lock, max trailer tow, hd tires, elect camper mirrors, 4X4, and custom cab high cap, and 7700 gvwr pkg. The truck started to shudder almost right away. It has gotten worse with more mileage, which is now only 3,740 miles. It has been back to the dealer six times already! It shuddered from 1700 rpm to 2700rpm until 3000 miles and now it is 1100 rpm to 2000rpm. It is low when empty, and becomes greater as I put weight in the bed, or people in the cab , or tow a trailer. My big trailer, a sprinter 277 camper is 33 feet and 9000 lbs, shakes so bad that my ice coffee in the console cup spills its contents. Ford is at a loss as to what can be done to solve this. I really enjoyed reading your sollutions, and am going to try the add a leaf idea first I believe. Thanks everyone !!
10-06-2014, 09:37 AM
#388
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Join Date: Oct 2014
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Acceleration shudder lives on !
I just got a chance to tow my car trailer with my F150 after it came back from the sixth visit with Ford Dealer. The shudder is still there, all the time, empty or towing. My truck was built on 11-28-2013, should have been a 2014 truck !
The dealer did reprogram the transmission, and the turbo's to kick in at around 1650 rpms, so the truck has a lot more get up and go ! I can get on the expressway now and step on it to jump into traffic better. In about two hundred yards onto the expressway I can be going 65 mph or better now ! The truck has plenty of power to pull the trailers etc. Towing actually is better than my Toyota Tundra that I traded in for this truck. That truck had been factory bumped up to 406 HP and 426 LBS FT.
Sometimes the Ecoboost will actually give me good gas mileage too! One camping trip of 135 miles it returned 13.8 mpg towing the 9000 lb camper. I have also gotten 21 plus mpg while just running around empty.
My camping friend traded his F150 5.0 in for a F-250 supercab. He tows a 10,000 lb trailer. He gets &.1 towing and the best empty mileage as 14 plus mpg. That is quite a big difference though! Plus his new truck is not as comfortable or quiet as the F150 is. Tha Ecoboost truck is a much more pleasant ride to be in daily, don't you agree!
I am still trying to get the regional tech support person to come and ride in my truck , so I can show Ford where the problem really lies. Wish me luck!!
The dealer did reprogram the transmission, and the turbo's to kick in at around 1650 rpms, so the truck has a lot more get up and go ! I can get on the expressway now and step on it to jump into traffic better. In about two hundred yards onto the expressway I can be going 65 mph or better now ! The truck has plenty of power to pull the trailers etc. Towing actually is better than my Toyota Tundra that I traded in for this truck. That truck had been factory bumped up to 406 HP and 426 LBS FT.
Sometimes the Ecoboost will actually give me good gas mileage too! One camping trip of 135 miles it returned 13.8 mpg towing the 9000 lb camper. I have also gotten 21 plus mpg while just running around empty.
My camping friend traded his F150 5.0 in for a F-250 supercab. He tows a 10,000 lb trailer. He gets &.1 towing and the best empty mileage as 14 plus mpg. That is quite a big difference though! Plus his new truck is not as comfortable or quiet as the F150 is. Tha Ecoboost truck is a much more pleasant ride to be in daily, don't you agree!
I am still trying to get the regional tech support person to come and ride in my truck , so I can show Ford where the problem really lies. Wish me luck!!
10-07-2014, 04:47 AM
#389
Junior Member
Good luck to ya. It sounds like you're having better luck with your dealer than I had with mine. They declared it a characteristic of the truck. I plan on putting air bags on mine as I have different loads in the bed almost daily. On a side note, I need to research that turbo adjustment. Mine has too much lag and drives me nuts. Keep us posted on the shudder progress.
10-27-2014, 04:51 PM
#390
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2011 F150 Ecoboost Shutter Solved
2011 Ford F150 Ecoboost - Solved
After experiencing shutter described all over this forum with loss of power and engine light ON, today I replaced the plugs. Ford told me that the original plugs (SP-528) were replaced with SP-538. Must be a reason...
Easy install (about 45 minutes). After replacing the truck now has the power that I loved and smooth as silk. All plugs looked OK except for one that spot on the side that I assume was part if not the problem. See pic
I love this truck but the shuttering that I had over the last several weeks concerned me. I have 93K miles, so plugs were due anyway.
Interesting facts: Gas mileage since I bought new in 2011 has been great at 21 MPG on highway easily. If I baby it and not exceed 70MPH, I have gotten as much as 23.6 MPG from Dallas to Galveston.
I will continue to monitor and report any changes that occur but it was very evident on my test drive that there was a clear difference.