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View Poll Results: Who are you pulling for?
Obama 19 21.11%
Romney 61 67.78%
Not Voting. 10 11.11%
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Old 10-04-2012, 07:34 AM   #801
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Originally Posted by MR.FX4

Ladies and gentlemen i present to you THE 47%

no matter what Romney says there must be some hidden agenda to kill granny and hurt the middle class. Facts be damned, no mater what he is lying

On the flip side any failure of Obamas is not because he lacks evidence to support his claims or defend the last 4 years, he is just being a nice guy and wants to look presidential. Thus is why Romney is not focusing on gaining their vote, it is impossible unless he put a "D" in front of his name.

The problem is just that, Obama is great at LOOKING presidential and campaigning for the job. Where he fails is actually BEING presidential. He makes great speeches when he has no one to challenge his b.s. That is why he stopped giving press interviews, too many people asking questions about his lies. It is much easier to give a speech in front of a crowd of supporters and have them swallow every promise and spin as gospel. The liberal media began defending a expected poor debate performance by Obama days ago because "he is not a good debater", i think the truth it's they knew Obama has no evidence to stand on and could only lie or tell sweet grandma stories that the people who follow these debates largely see as the distraction tactic that it is.

I suspect Obama stayed away from the 47% comment to avoid a sure response from Romney about the "you didn't build that" speech where Obama took credit for the success of all businesses because of government. I'm still waiting for the gubment to build the business across from my County installed road and make me CEO. Then when it catches fire I'll look for the federal fire fighters to come put it out, hopefully by then I'll have me an obama phone to call 911
Obama's more popular to have dinner with!!
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Old 10-04-2012, 07:44 AM   #802
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Originally Posted by jumpseat82

Obama's more popular to have dinner with!!

Attachment 150708

Here was obamas problem last night, he will be sure to pack it next time
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Old 10-04-2012, 07:58 AM   #803
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Originally Posted by bobkyle2

Exactly.... I was sorta wanting Romney to talk to me.
A debate is meant to be a controlled argument between the opponents on their issues. There are plenty of stump speeches where they address the people (voters).

How about a big round of applause for bk2 participating in the discussion

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Old 10-04-2012, 08:00 AM   #804
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Originally Posted by opinyawn
Romney one, Obama zero!

Romney did a great job tonight doing what he had to do, but anyone that has followed his campaign and his positions knows very well that he says whatever is necessary at the time! He did a good job doing that! He did his homework!

He came up with what were actually five numbered generalizations that he passed off as specifics that will likely work on many! As a person that will vote for Obama I was frustrated that Obama let Romney off so easy and took the punches without offering much of a counter attack. Either Obama was having a really bad night, or his strategy is to make his case without looking like he was attacking Romney with negative shots during the debates! The problem attacking Romney on his obvious negatives such as his constantly changing positions, the 47% remarks, his off shore accounts, and attacking the president in the middle of the Embassy crisis, etc. is that it would make Obama look less presidential and engaging in negative attacks. Obviously Romney is wide open to zingers about flip flopping, his taxes, and the 47% remarks, but I suspect Obama thinks it is a mistake for that to come out of his mouth and look negative. Obama could have told Romney, "I'm willing to pay just a little bit more for my country, why aren't you Mitt?" But I suppose likeability is something Obama doesn't want to risk losing by being harsh in the debates. If that is the strategy, and I think it is, it is a dangerous one because it lets Romney take shots at Obama without good shots being sent back. It reminds me of Mohammed Ali's "Rope a Dope" strategy where he took shots on the ropes in fights and still won the fight in the end by close decisions.

I suspect Obama will do much better in the next debate because it is a "Town Hall" approach that will rely on thinking on your feet and answering questions rather than relying on an rehearsed attack. Also the economy is obviously where Obama is most vulnerable! It doesn't matter what caused this deep recession that started in Bush's presidency.... the president is supposed to fix it quickly somehow! We are Americans and we don't like to wait!

In the final analysis it will boil down to is whether or not the uncommited voters will trust in what Romney is saying "now" during the debates which is basically that no one will have to pay a cent more, no one will be harmed by his cuts, and everything will be payed for by closing tax loop holes and massive job creation! I can't imagine Mitt Romney pushing to close tax loopholes for corporations and the top 2%! It seems to me that anyone that has followed Romney's campaign will see it as just another version of Mitt the chameleon, but those uncommitted voters that just tuned in to the campaign may believe what he is saying... this time around. We won't know the answer to that question until the election is over!

If Mitt is successful good luck to those that will need Medicare in a few years, because it will die a slow death once it is converted to a voucher system approach! Mitt's latest change of policy is smart! It is on the surface to keep both Medicare and private insurance... but anyone who knows about such programs knows that the voucher system will kill medicare dead as costs go up! Mitt knows that too, but it is a smart move! Bush wanted to kill Medicare, but Romney may just get it done. After we kill all the labor unions and kill Medicare we will be on the road back to the "King Corporation Days" before FDR and all the gains from the Great Depression forward will be eroded! That will help us compete with China, because our workers will be gradually getting close to being treated like Chinese workers!

As I keep saying, "Look at the level of the stock market and the IRS statistics as to where the wealth of this country has gone in recent years! To the Romneys.... not to the Middle Class that this country depends on! Those are solid facts to be accepted, or denied! Your choice! We are still a wealthy country, we just spend our money in the wrong places.... that is, not on our citizens' needs!
You said "The President is somehow supposed to fix it quickly". How many more years do you need? He has had 3 1/2 years. I mean if he couldn't fix 50% of the problems that this country is doomed with, than what makes you think he can do it in another 4 years? I don't lean to any specific side. I just want someone to help this country before it crashes around us and never recovers. It can happen. I come from a huge military family. The main thing that I have against Obama is wanting to cut military and at the same time take the guns from the citizens of the US. So who is going to protect us when a country tries to invade the US. Then we can't protect ourselves. Now I don't agree with these BS wars that we are in but i do believe he should bring the troops home and focus on the wars that are going on all over the US. Open you eyes people. There are wars on the streets of the US ever day. Pick up the newspaper and don't read the crap that resides on half of the paper. Read the other half that shows how Kids are killing other kids. They are also robbing, stealing, and destroying our country. And I come from these same streets and have seen it first hand. Wake up
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Old 10-04-2012, 08:31 AM   #805
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Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
Was Obama's strategy to lay back as he did and stay away from any direct attacks on Romney for flip flopping or Romney's 47% comment, etc.? Obviously the Romney supporter will be very happy with Romney's attack dog performance tonight which he carried out very well, but that doesn't really matter because Romney already had their vote. The big question is what will the uncommitted voter think of Romney's performance? That's all that matters as those are the only votes in play!
Attack Dog Performance? What was wrong with Mitt going after Obama on the issues? That’s kinda the point isn’t it. I see all the ads and let me tell ya, Obama is more than happy to get into attack mode. Once he was face to face he wouldn’t even look at Mitt.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobkyle2 View Post

(I'm not anywhere near as politics smart as most of you are/think you are.But, most people are not. That is why i'm telling my thoughts.)

That's about where i thought it was [IMG]file:///C:\DOCUME~1\ARoots\LOCALS~1\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip_ image001.gif[/IMG]
Don’t worry, most folks aren’t as (politically) smart as they believe themselves to be.



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Originally Posted by bobkyle2 View Post
I wouldn't doubt that one bit, But Romney was talking to Obama.Just bam bam bam, I want him to talk to me(voter)
Romney was just doing as instructed by Mr. Lehrer

LEHRER: Both of you have spoken about a lot of different things, and we're going to try to get through them in as specific a way as we possibly can.
But, first, Governor Romney, do you have a question that you'd like to ask the president directly about something he just said?

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
That sounds good, but makes no sense to me. Granted that Florida has more seniors, but everyone goes through the same stages of life and eventually needs the same care where ever they are. I think that's just Romney's weak excuse why Romneycare made lots of sense in Mass when he was governor, but now the same basic plan called Obamacare doesn't make sense in the other 49 states! Wouldn't it be a hoot if Romney was elected and he found a under the table way to keep Obamacare/Romneycare and blame the Democrats! A man who cares for the needs of the country might do that! After all a Southerner and Texan called LBJ fought for civil rights in the South and lost the South for the Democratic party until this day. Whoda thunk that?
It makes perfect sense.

Quote:
10th Amendment to the Constitution: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
The federal government overstepped their bounds. The State of Massachusetts did not as it is clearly a state matter. Obama discussed health care with George Stephanopoulos. When he was asked about it being a tax, Obama said: "A responsibility to get health insurance is not a tax increase."

Odd. SCJ John Roberts said this:
Quote:
“Simply put, Congress may tax and spend,” Roberts wrote in the majority opinion. “This grant gives the federal government considerable influence even in areas where it cannot directly regulate.”
“The federal government may enact a tax on an activity that it cannot authorize, forbid or otherwise control,”
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Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
Romney one, Obama zero!

Romney did a great job tonight doing what he had to do, but anyone that has followed his campaign and his positions knows very well that he says whatever is necessary at the time! ………………………………………

And Obama didn’t?

Here, I don’t feel like posting all of the promises he made to get into office then broke. Of course he has quite a few that I’m glad weren’t put into place anyway but it goes to show that Obama is willing to say what he has to so he can get elected (and reelected)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...romise-broken/

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Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
The problem attacking Romney on his obvious negatives such as his constantly changing positions, the 47% remarks, his off shore accounts, and attacking the president in the middle of the Embassy crisis, etc. is that it would make Obama look less presidential and engaging in negative attacks. Obviously Romney is wide open to zingers about flip flopping, his taxes, and the 47% remarks, but I suspect Obama thinks it is a mistake for that to come out of his mouth and look negative.
The 47% comment isn't an issue except to the far left. We all know that a certain percentage will vote Obama no matter what. Mitt was speaking about not going after their vote because they will not go for Mitt anyway. He was just stating a simple fact and explaining some of the people that fall into the 47%. Now is that percentage exactly 47%? I have no idea but I know it is a substantial number.

----------------------------------------------------


Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
Obama could have told Romney, "I'm willing to pay just a little bit more for my country, why aren't you Mitt?" But I suppose likeability is something Obama doesn't want to risk losing by being harsh in the debates. If that is the strategy, and I think it is, it is a dangerous one because it lets Romney take shots at Obama without good shots being sent back. It reminds me of Mohammed Ali's "Rope a Dope" strategy where he took shots on the ropes in fights and still won the fight in the end by close decisions.
Yes, Mitt is willing to do so and has.

Mitt Romney Paid More Taxes Than Required, Raising Rate to 14.1 Percent

Next.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/...4#.UG10u661tI4

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Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
I don't agree he has no record to run on! He was just off his game tonight for sure!

The difference is you guys called it Obamacare in a derisive, disrespectful way to devalue it. Obama has to accept the name and take to his own or he would seem ashamed of it himself! I'm surprised he didn't call it Romneycare tonight and thank Romney for his help with it! Obama on his game may have done that! Obama was really off tonight! Who knows why? Maybe he was under the weather or exhausted, but that wasn't his A or even B game!
He did acknowledge it in a way.

PRESIDENT OBAMA: Now, the last point I'd make before……. that the irony is that we've seen this model work really well in Massachusetts, because Governor Romney did a good thing, working with Democrats in the state to set up what is essentially the identical model. And as a consequence, people are covered there. It hasn't destroyed jobs. And as a consequence, we now have a system in which we have the opportunity to start bringing down cost, as opposed to just……leaving millions of people out in the cold.

He was actually wrong but he did give Mitt credit. MittCare is a bit different. It was done at a state level so it doesn’t crap all over the 10th amendment. As for the actual facts on whether or not it did or didn’t raise taxes, I don’t know. I’m from Missouri, that is a Massachusetts issue and I tend to stay out of other states matters.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------


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Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
Don't you think he meant before he made some money with his books!

Remember Romneys father was a multimillionaire but Romney lived in a basement eating Mac & Cheese on an old door won saw horses! LOL!
Obama was never poor.
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:17 AM   #806
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Mitt says healthcare works at state level, but not federal.. I didn't realize people get sick differently by state
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theocoog View Post
The availability of health care and health care technology varies widely from state to state. So do the ages and general health of the population. I think his point is that a plan that works well in one state may not work so well in another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
That sounds good, but makes no sense to me. Granted that Florida has more seniors, but everyone goes through the same stages of life and eventually needs the same care where ever they are. I think that's just Romney's weak excuse why Romneycare made lots of sense in Mass when he was governor, but now the same basic plan called Obamacare doesn't make sense in the other 49 states! Wouldn't it be a hoot if Romney was elected and he found a under the table way to keep Obamacare/Romneycare and blame the Democrats! A man who cares for the needs of the country might do that! After all a Southerner and Texan called LBJ fought for civil rights in the South and lost the South for the Democratic party until this day. Whoda thunk that?
Whether or not it makes sense to you has no bearing on the accuracy of the statement.

People do not all go through the same stages of life: some die at an early age from disease, some live much longer than the national average, people of all ages are killed in accidents. You know all this is true. People age at different rates, so that some people are healthy and lucid in their 90's and others are in poor health by the time they are 55 or 60.

Everyone's medical needs are different: a 35 year old suffering from cancer has the possibility of getting much better care in a major city than at a rural hospital. The big cities have the technology. You don't find a lot of PET scanners out in the rural areas of our country.

Where you live has a significant impact on the quality of health care that you receive. Here is one ranking: http://www.webmd.com/news/20070613/h...on-health-care

Here is another from a different source: http://statesnapshots.ahrq.gov/snaps11/

There are many other rankings if you take the time to do some basic research. The point is that Romney knows that health care programs belong at the state level - there is no one-size-fits-all policy that can be applied at the national level that provides quality care for everyone. Different states have different needs, and the technology current available varies from state to state as well. A health care plan/policy that is designed for California probably isn't going to be applicable to a state like Vermont.

If you don't believe this, or it still doesn't make sense, ask your doctor where he/she would prefer to receive treatment in a critical care situation. Ask them if they think different states have different needs.
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:27 AM   #807
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Even if Romney wins, I highly doubt Romneycare will make it past congress.
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:29 AM   #808
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Even if Romney wins, I highly doubt Romneycare will make it past congress.
Huh? Who is trying to pass romneycare?
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:34 AM   #809
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Huh? Who is trying to pass romneycare?
I was reading posts from last night and it was mentioned
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:38 AM   #810
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Romney is for individual states to pass their own versions.
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