Go Back   Ford F150 Forum - Community of Ford Truck Fans > Community > Off-Topic
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


View Poll Results: Who are you pulling for?
Obama 19 21.11%
Romney 61 67.78%
Not Voting. 10 11.11%
Voters: 90. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-06-2012, 11:17 AM   #991
Go AZ CATS!
 
cogsbme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Thanks: 2
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn View Post
What I say is from a Moderate Liberal so of course automatically wrong, so let me quote Dr. Joseph Stiglitz the Nobel Laureate Economist that was on the Charlie Rose Show tonight:

"If we had the efficient healthcare systems of Europe we would have little or no national debt!"

Does that answer the question of why Obama put "The Affordable Healthcare Act" as a priority? Probably not, ..... but it certainly should! It's what Obama has been saying all along!

(The below is paraphrased because I couldn't write fast enough)

Our government policies like Capital Gains encourage making profits that create no value. If you buy land and sell it for three times as much you have not made more land or created anything of any value. You have just made a profit that created nothing, so why tax it less that a workman's sweat earned income? That's what much of Wall Street does today. It makes a profit while creating nothing of value like buying crude oil it can't even take delivery on, then manipulating the price and reselling a piece of paper for a huge profit! Nothing was created but higher gasoline prices! Why tax them at a lower rate than a working man's sweat earned income? It encourages investment that produce nothing of value!

The great inequality in this country is partially created by taxing investment far less that that of a working man's sweat earned income. Many are taxed only 14% for producing absolutely nothing but a profit for themselves!

If you travel around the world as I do you realize that we have a 3rd world infrastructure and the U.S. is becoming one of the industrialized nations hardest to improve yourself in, mainly because of our lack of investment in education. Germany is doing better than the U.S. because of it's apprenticeship program in education and its involvement of workers in corporate management.

Getting the public to spend more is not always good! Increasing consumption is not good particularly if it cannot be maintained by their good investments and savings! Over consumption is part of what caused the real estate bubble!

The diversity between the 1%, or maybe even the 1/10th of one percent and the 99% is weakening the democracy of the country due to the tremendous power of the wealthy to control the country. Example, the Congress is now being used to eliminate competition and create monopoly type payments form the 99% to the 1%. Drug manufacturers got Congress to pass a law that Medicare which is the largest purchaser of drugs in the world must pay the dictated price of the drug manufacturers without negotiation. It will cost trillions of dollars per decade. The Affordable Healthcare Act ends that which one of the reasons it is opposed.

These are only the ideas of the Nobel Prize winning economist... so what does he know!
First, land does not just go up for no reason. Land increases in value based on several reasons. The person/company who bought it has been able to put it to a more highly productive use (farming, factory, infrastructure), or demand for raw land has increased due to a rising/growing economy. The sweat of the working man is paid for in the form of a salary. Second your capital gains assumption is just that, an assumption. When you sell your house that you bought should the proceeds (gains) be taxed as income? Didn't you already pay income taxes on the funds to buy the house? This is double taxation (with out representation). The gains a company realizes is tax favorably only if it is held for the longterm, otherwise it is taxed at income levels, and when the company pays out those gains on the sale of land to employees (salary, bonus), those earnings are taxed at income levels (double taxation). Remeber there are corporate taxes and peresonal taxes (too many taxes if you ask me). Crude oil is a supply/demand game that is affected by geopolitical issues and yes probable manipulation of contracts. But again, if it is short term trading it is not tax advantaged, it is taxed as ordinary income, as almost all of these contracts are because they are less than 1 yr in maturity. Also, not all contracts are manipulated. Some are used as hedging facilities to lock in costs for companies so that they can know their cost structure.

Short term investment are taxed at income levels, long-term are currently at 15%. And its not about creating nothing. this is the supply of capital to make a profit. Investiors supply companies with capital. In return for that capital they require a rate of return based on the risk level of the investment. if profit is not to be made, progress will slow to a crawl. All of this wonderful mediacal technology would be non-existent. Profit/capitaslism stinulates innovation. this is evidenced by the USA is the most productive and technologically leading country in the world.

your statement that germany is doing better than the US is subjective at best. They have created some very good programs, but not all is well in the Dueschtland. they are the benefactors of the EU at the sacrifice of all other EU contries. By your comparisons, they are the US of the EU. This may change your argument. We definitely need to learn from others (especially their misstakes). but I will be very clear, socialism is no substitute for capitalism. The proof is in the pudding. No country has near the standard of living as the USA.

Also just become someone is a nobel economist, doesn't mean threy are right. that like saying because time magazine named Hitler mans of the year (1938), that he is a nice guy.
__________________
2012 XLT 4x4
Chrome Pkg
Tow Pkg
Sliding rear window
MS Synch

Last edited by cogsbme; 10-06-2012 at 11:21 AM.
cogsbme is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 11:32 AM   #992
Bacon Grower
 
Hunttman01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 27,243
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Thanks: 134
Thanked 164 Times in 136 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by opinyawn
What I say is from a Moderate Liberal so of course automatically wrong, so let me quote Dr. Joseph Stiglitz the Nobel Laureate Economist that was on the Charlie Rose Show tonight:

"If we had the efficient healthcare systems of Europe we would have little or no national debt!"

Does that answer the question of why Obama put "The Affordable Healthcare Act" as a priority? Probably not, ..... but it certainly should! It's what Obama has been saying all along!

(The below is paraphrased because I couldn't write fast enough)

Our government policies like Capital Gains encourage making profits that create no value. If you buy land and sell it for three times as much you have not made more land or created anything of any value. You have just made a profit that created nothing, so why tax it less that a workman's sweat earned income? That's what much of Wall Street does today. It makes a profit while creating nothing of value like buying crude oil it can't even take delivery on, then manipulating the price and reselling a piece of paper for a huge profit! Nothing was created but higher gasoline prices! Why tax them at a lower rate than a working man's sweat earned income? It encourages investment that produce nothing of value!

The great inequality in this country is partially created by taxing investment far less that that of a working man's sweat earned income. Many are taxed only 14% for producing absolutely nothing but a profit for themselves!

If you travel around the world as I do you realize that we have a 3rd world infrastructure and the U.S. is becoming one of the industrialized nations hardest to improve yourself in, mainly because of our lack of investment in education. Germany is doing better than the U.S. because of it's apprenticeship program in education and its involvement of workers in corporate management.

Getting the public to spend more is not always good! Increasing consumption is not good particularly if it cannot be maintained by their good investments and savings! Over consumption is part of what caused the real estate bubble!

The diversity between the 1%, or maybe even the 1/10th of one percent and the 99% is weakening the democracy of the country due to the tremendous power of the wealthy to control the country. Example, the Congress is now being used to eliminate competition and create monopoly type payments form the 99% to the 1%. Drug manufacturers got Congress to pass a law that Medicare which is the largest purchaser of drugs in the world must pay the dictated price of the drug manufacturers without negotiation. It will cost trillions of dollars per decade. The Affordable Healthcare Act ends that which one of the reasons it is opposed.

These are only the ideas of the Nobel Prize winning economist... so what does he know!
Land is on the rise due to the supply and demand. We have less tillable ground in the US every year. In the next 20 years, farmers will have to feed twice as much people on half the land. Want cheap land? Stop the expansion of cities and towns
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by volsbear View Post
You got screwed for money. You're a hooker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95stepside View Post
Hey now, we're not all rich enough to not take our tires down to slicks...
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannofx4 View Post
I didn't beleive in god until I was at the mall last weekend. Following three "ladies" up the escalator wearing Yoga pants. At that point I knew...there is a God!
Hunttman01 is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 11:51 AM   #993
opinions are like *****...
 
MR.FX4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 3,200
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 16 Times in 15 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunttman01

Land is on the rise due to the supply and demand. We have less tillable ground in the US every year. In the next 20 years, farmers will have to feed twice as much people on half the land. Want cheap land? Stop the expansion of cities and towns
He does not care about the amount of land one bit. He cares about taxing people as much as possible and punishing capitalism to fund a massive cradle to grave federal government in place of individual responsibility and liberty, Liberty, LIBERTY, LIBERTY!!!!!!
__________________
2010 Ferd F Teen Thousand - FX4
2wd e-locker Mod, "gotts" mod, Bakflip F1, bedrug, N-FAB 6 step nerf bars, Nfab Light Bar, Rancho 4 inch lift, HD tails, x3 tuned by 5star. 295/60/20 Nittos on Fuel wheels.
MR.FX4 is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:01 PM   #994
Nicer than ymeski56
 
XtraLargeTall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Fort Morgan, Colorado/Curtis, NE
Posts: 21,708
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Thanks: 136
Thanked 437 Times in 319 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunttman01

Land is on the rise due to the supply and demand. We have less tillable ground in the US every year. In the next 20 years, farmers will have to feed twice as much people on half the land. Want cheap land? Stop the expansion of cities and towns
Your numbers are slightly off. 9 billion people by 2050 on a shrinking amount of land, the amount we have no clue as there is alot of less productive ground not in production currently that could be converted. But I do agree, the rapid urban expansion is encroaching on farm ground and cities are drying up farmground for the water. And then they complain about rising food costs...
XtraLargeTall is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:03 PM   #995
Bacon Grower
 
Hunttman01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 27,243
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Thanks: 134
Thanked 164 Times in 136 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by XtraLargeTall

Your numbers are slightly off. 9 billion people by 2050 on a shrinking amount of land, the amount we have no clue as there is alot of less productive ground not in production currently that could be converted. But I do agree, the rapid urban expansion is encroaching on farm ground and cities are drying up farmground for the water. And then they complain about rising food costs...
Thanks. I couldn't remember the exact numbers
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by volsbear View Post
You got screwed for money. You're a hooker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95stepside View Post
Hey now, we're not all rich enough to not take our tires down to slicks...
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannofx4 View Post
I didn't beleive in god until I was at the mall last weekend. Following three "ladies" up the escalator wearing Yoga pants. At that point I knew...there is a God!
Hunttman01 is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:13 PM   #996
Just Another Member
 
Theocoog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New England
Posts: 1,242
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Thanks: 78
Thanked 86 Times in 61 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by XtraLargeTall

Your numbers are slightly off. 9 billion people by 2050 on a shrinking amount of land, the amount we have no clue as there is alot of less productive ground not in production currently that could be converted. But I do agree, the rapid urban expansion is encroaching on farm ground and cities are drying up farmground for the water. And then they complain about rising food costs...
What do you propose as a solution to this urban expansion?
__________________
2011 F150 3.5L EcoBoost XLT 4x4 Off-Road, 3.73 ELD, 6.5' Bed, Dark Blue Pearl Metallic
Theocoog is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:38 PM   #997
Assistant Administrator
5 Year Member
 
ymeski56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Long Beach Calimexifornia
Posts: 31,004
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Thanks: 51
Thanked 587 Times in 345 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cogsbme View Post
Also just become someone is a nobel economist, doesn't mean threy are right. that like saying because time magazine named Hitler mans of the year (1938), that he is a nice guy.
Click the image to open in full size.

The Nobel Prize ain't what it used to be.
__________________
"Saving the World....One Ford Truck at a Time."

Last edited by ymeski56; 10-06-2012 at 12:55 PM.
ymeski56 is online now  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:44 PM   #998
opinions are like *****...
 
MR.FX4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 3,200
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 16 Times in 15 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gone postal View Post
Have you ever tried to get a bureaucracy to shift? I have, easier said than done. The government CANNOT change the rules midstream, as the rules are usually set up in response to laws or federal regulations, and changes to regulations take a minimum of 6 months to a year to change. .
Obviously you have more insight to government workings than me having been on the other side. However we both know that the government can do as it pleases many times as they set and enforce that rules. The executive branch recently announced a change in policy. They implemented provisions of the dream act, going against federal law and regulation. No laws changed and it didnít take a year. They also changed policy and decided to simply not defend DOMA. Just basically ignore the law because it does not fit an agenda. Laws and policy are two different things and we both know they donít always coincide. Now look what is going on with the WARN ACT. The numbers will potentially hurt a politician so they will try and bypass rules and regulations to stop information, then the government offers to cover legal fees if employers break the law (which they are not now because there are no defined cuts). Too much effort within government to distort the truth, thatís why Iím always skeptical

Quote:
Originally Posted by gone postal View Post
Part time power plant engineers dont exist in Massachusetts because of regulatory requirements, pesky little things set in place after too many boiler explosions. It would theoretically be possible to hire a part time power plant engineer, however, the requirements for the license realistically preclude that possibility. The point to the story is that the statisticians and efficiency experts were hired to reduce complement in that particular operation. The data and regulations precluded actually doing so, but they still came out with the "desired" result. They got the numbers they were paid to find. .

It sounds like they did their job. A statistician operating in a vacuum can only give you data; it is up to the analyzers to decide what it means. Thatís not to say that the data canít be manipulated by altering the information used to derive said data or a statitician looking to come to a preset conclusion.
As to part time engineers, I have seen and used them many times in my industry. Usually they are semi-retired individuals with many years of experience and qualifications. As long as they put in the time and training to remain certified I donít see the issue with it. If Massachusetts does not like it in their state then by all means itís their choice to make

Quote:
Originally Posted by gone postal View Post
That's one reason government employees are difficult to fire, the system basically precludes that from occurring. Besides, the boss' next promotion depends more on the review panel sitting for whatever his/her next step might be, not the political appointee in charge..
What does that review panel look at to decide promotion? The performance of job? For a middle to upper level employee it would be the performance of the group or agency that person is over is it not? (serious question, I never worked in government). If the head of an agency is an appointee or simply an ideologue they may influence an outcome to please those higher up and potentially go before a more "favorable" review panel. There is no way in my opinion to completely remove the buddy or "good ole boy" system. Many times government employees are cherry picked by administrations and given appointed jobs within the administration so the incentive to perform acceptably in their eyes is always there.


Quote:
Originally Posted by gone postal View Post
And the BLS has been using the same metric for ages. It didn't change last week before the debates.

Ok? I dont think i said it did. I believe I have been very consistant from the beginning saying that the unemployment numbers are a sham due to these formulas. That is why we keep hearing about the "real" unemployment vs. "official" unemployment.

Inflation not including food or gas? Well thats our governments level of intelligence at times. Too volatile my a ss
__________________
2010 Ferd F Teen Thousand - FX4
2wd e-locker Mod, "gotts" mod, Bakflip F1, bedrug, N-FAB 6 step nerf bars, Nfab Light Bar, Rancho 4 inch lift, HD tails, x3 tuned by 5star. 295/60/20 Nittos on Fuel wheels.

Last edited by MR.FX4; 10-06-2012 at 01:43 PM.
MR.FX4 is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:59 PM   #999
Assistant Administrator
5 Year Member
 
ymeski56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Long Beach Calimexifornia
Posts: 31,004
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Thanks: 51
Thanked 587 Times in 345 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Click the image to open in full size.

Snoop Dog's Top Ten List's:

Click the image to open in full size.

See Link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...=entertainment


The intent of this post is to show the frivolity of many celebrity endorsements. No doubt they exist for "both" candidates.
__________________
"Saving the World....One Ford Truck at a Time."

Last edited by ymeski56; 10-06-2012 at 02:15 PM.
ymeski56 is online now  
Old 10-06-2012, 01:14 PM   #1000
Eat. Sleep. Lift.
 
amick218's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 8,137
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Thanks: 24
Thanked 26 Times in 24 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ymeski56

Snoop Dog's Top Ten List's:
Very good contribution
__________________
The truth is that you may not have what it takes, you may not be committed enough, you may not have the discipline, you may not put in enough effort, you might not work hard enough, you do not believe in yourself, you're full of excuses, you get distracted too easy. To wrap it up in one statement: you really don't ing care enough.
amick218 is offline  
Old 10-06-2012, 01:14 PM
 
 
 
Closed Thread

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Join F150 Forum

 

The Mustang Source
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright © 2006 - 20011 F150forum.com
This site is in no way affiliated with the Ford Motor Company.