vdfsuspension

Eveny Trophy Trucks break...it is part of desert racing.

Batman420

V8 with some type of forced induction will beat any v6 ecoboost

ZBoater

I know that. That's not the point. The point is that Ford and SVT staked their reputation on finishing the Baja 1000. If you watch the Born in Baja movie it might make more sense. There's interviews with Ford execs and all sorts of discussion on why they chose Baja as the "litmus test" for the Raptor, and how it was all about credibility.

This is not a Tremor or a Lightning. They went for something totally new and different in the automotive industry. Something this off road capable rolling off an assembly line, not hacked together with aftermarket parts in some performance shop. And they succeeded.

You have to watch that movie to truly appreciate what all went into designing and producing this truck. They can come up with a different version with a different name, but to come up with another Raptor theyre not just going to slap a new engine in an aluminum frame and say "2016 Raptor!".

WarSurfer

Only one DNF'd due to breakage - it finished but it was outside the timing window. The other finished in 38hrs 20mins. Not lightning fast but considering there were numerous folks at the 44 & 46 hour mark it not a bad showing. Ford also recently ran its 2.7tt through Baja dressed in 14 skin. It finished but was still given a DNF because of the class it was forced to race in. The first two ECO race trucks had their own class, the re-skin Eco ran in an established class that had a smaller timing window (ie the other vehicles were much faster).

Just finishing Baja is an achievement and Ford has done it with the Raptors, and two Eco racers. I'd say their batting average is pretty good.

There are several takeaways that I think are being missed...

When the two 3.5TT trucks ran they started with the fueling data they used on the Raptors. Instead of running at 3.5mpg as planned they were making over 8mpg. That changed their fueling strategy and if that had been in a competitive setting, it would have had a tremendous impact - but they were in their own class racing each other.

Neither time Eco's were run were they meant to be competitive, it was about finishing the race. The 3.5s were doing it as part of a torture test and were handicapped by being forced to use the 'hero engines' that had already been beat on for 100k miles. The objective was to finish.

The 2.7 was handicapped by running mostly stock components, including the suspension.

There is a race season coming up with no Raptor in production. It's possible, now that the classes exist, Ford will put forward an Eco racer that would be more competitive. Like maybe an all aluminum '15 with a more aggressive 3.5TT.

Less weight, more power, mo betta.

I guess my point is, the stage is set for a competitive showing like the Raptor R right around production time.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/deser...t-results.html

WarSurfer

As I already posted, the first Raptors came with 5.4s and dealers couldn't keep them on the lots. The Raptor is a regular F150 with better suspension, some fancy electronics and a steering wheel with a stripe on it.

If the new engine produces more power / torque than the 6.2 of the first gen Raptor, I don't see any negative impact on sales - especially if Ford puts forth a real race truck for 2015 that's ECO powered.

vdfsuspension

I know the head of the Off Road division at Ford, he's at every BITD race, and I know Ford will not stop making the Raptor if they keep selling.

Especially with the shear amount of businesses out there that specialize in Raptor specific products, there is no way they will stop making them.

SVT4MT

I've always wanted to see the 650hp supercharged 5.8L in the GT500's as a factory offering for the Raptor option list, screw the Eco.

The V8 makes the truck, put in an Eco, and I'll never buy another, which is why I scooped my '14, get while the gettin's good so to speak.

WarSurfer

It's all well and good to dream but there are two problems with using that engine.

1) no supercharged v8 class in Baja
2) it is very difficult to manage heat soak with a top mount - we are talking about sustained runs at 5-6k RPMs FOR HOURS ON END. It just isn't practical. Would it be fun, of course it would.

You have to remember that the driving force (no pun intended) behind the Raptor was to provide a vehicle that the 'Everyman' could afford and would serve as at least an 80% solution for competing.

A Raptor won its class in the Paris to Dakar Rally with nothing more than an upgrade to KING shocks.

Lots of folks say, "I'll never buy another if they put that 6 in it". When you are at a Raptor run and the Eco Raptors are just destroying the v8's, lots of folks will change their tune.

ZBoater

Ummmmm, ok. Then I guess we can leave it here. No sense in discussing this further.

WarSurfer

Rather than making an attempt at condescension, you could elaborate on what part of my statement you feel is incorrect.

Cabs and bed structures are the same, front inner body structures are the same, frames are the same, brakes are the same, etc...

What then makes a Raptor 'unique'?

Unique interior - just like every other option package - we do get the SVT specific gauge panel and aux lighting panel.

Unique exterior bodywork - different bedsides but the same bed structure as every other 5.5ft bed. Unique composite front fenders, hood and FORD grill.

Unique rear axle assembly - actually it's the same 9.75 rear that comes in all F150's but it's 3 inches wider per side and has longer axles as well. There was a change in 2012 that made the diff more Raptor specific with the larger pinion bearing, etc...

Unique (garbage) rear leaf spring pack
Unique Fox shocks
Unique f350 lower shock mounts on the axles
Longer rear brake lines

Unique upper and lower control arms (wider)
Unique and somewhat adjustable front coilovers
Longer front brake lines
Longer front axles

Unique front bumper and skid plate package

Unique ABS controller that allows for hill descent control as well as being part of the high speed stability package when ORM is engaged.

When ORM is engaged the airbags are desensitized so they won't deploy on a hard hit, throttle sensitivity is reduced to prevent 'bucking' on uneven terrain and there are pitch and yaw sensors that when coupled with the ABS sensors these work together as an anti-rollover safeguard. Also while in ORM you can lock the rear and the speed limiter is raised to 100mph (locked) (with the aid of the Raptor specific TCCM).

There was a short period where the electronic locking rear was only available on Raptors - I believe you can get the locking rear with other packages now.

So to recap - the Raptor is an F150, made alongside non Raptor F150s in an F150 assembly plant. The Raptor specific electronics (different control modules) are installed as are the suspension parts and body panels.

The ONLY truly unique thing about Raptors is the ability to get a SCAB with a 5.5" bed. Aside from that EVERYTHING on a Raptor can be bolted on to a non Raptor.

Case in point - SDHQ Eco Raptor