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-   -   Internal Combustion & you! (http://www.f150forum.com/f11/internal-combustion-you-36727/)

ymeski56 11-15-2009 04:12 PM

Internal Combustion & you!
 
Here's a Kick Azz link I ran across in my eternal & sometimes monotonous search for the truth & "Whats really going on!" It sure kicked mine. I found it very..................................... Informative and................................Interesting and............................complete! I can't wait for the sequel! (If you have thoughts of setting yourself on fire to get out of reading the whole thing, for most people the urge passes quickly.) But if you're brave enough to stick it out to the end, when it comes to this subject, You'll be able to cut through the bullsh*t like a knife! If you make it, there's a surprise ending! I have been using it for 10yrs.(No,Not Crack!) & recommend 3 ozs./17 gals. http://www.smartgas.net/combustion.htm
UPDATE: The Link I was referring to seems to have gone south...However this Thread is still a great read!
http://i.imgur.com/ebyB0.gif

dr_bowtie 11-15-2009 04:28 PM

nice link...but I gotta say if you ponder that much about engines you my friend...need a hobby...;) (jokingly of coarse)

Acetone the additive is a natural octane booster....its what they add to raise the octane of fuel...Xylene is another additive...or was that the other way around....I gotta look that up as I used to make my own racing fuel by mixing my own...

ymeski56 11-15-2009 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr_bowtie (Post 310373)
nice link...but I gotta say if you ponder that much about engines you my friend...need a hobby...;) (jokingly of coarse)

I have a confession, I could only survive skip reading it! I fear reading the whole thing would kill a mortal man(w/ hobbies). But it will put you to sleep quicker than counting sheep! I've gotta go back though because I think the guy wrote the whole thing w/o using the "P" word once (PING). That would be something wouldn't it! I just gotta see that for myself, as I don't think that's possible. I think I saw "Inproperly Timed Combustion Happened" (ITCH) but I don't foresee that abbreviation ever catching on: "I think my engine is ITCHing!" My eyes where blurring at that point, I could have been mistaken.

farmer12 11-15-2009 07:53 PM

So where are you guys picking up acetone to do this? I wont lie I actually havent ever really looked for it but I'm thinking I might start adding it to my fuel. Any idea how much it brings the octane up? I usually run 91 but I dont see any problem with having a little more umphh in there.

ymeski56 11-15-2009 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmer12 (Post 310542)
So where are you guys picking up acetone to do this? I wont lie I actually havent ever really looked for it but I'm thinking I might start adding it to my fuel. Any idea how much it brings the octane up? I usually run 91 but I dont see any problem with having a little more umphh in there.

Well, if you must know, ya gots to go to a Beauty Supply store. You need the "Pure" non perfumed. The Acetone carried in Hardware stores have evaporation inhibitors added to it. That's not good. It's only a couple of bucks for a bottle & at 3 ozs./17 gals. it lasts a while. I use it in my Harley also. I add it & put the gas in right afterwards. The amount will vary by vehicle and more is not necessarily better. I use it for a better idle & a bump in MPG's. My 1/4 mile days are long gone & even then, I was skiing behind a boat when I did it. Anyway, you have to do a few treated tankfuls before you see the milage start to increase. If you want to speed up the process, start w/ a can of "SEAFOAM" through the air intake, and a bottle of "Lucas injection Cleaner" in the tank. The Acetone afterwards will have less contamination to muddle through!http://www.f150forum.com/f72/how-seafoam-eighth-gen-f150-1987-1991-a-31505/

farmer12 11-15-2009 09:20 PM

Wow cheif thats quite a good read, it is long and sometimes boring but twards the end it picks up and gives some good info about fuels and additives. Thanks for the info. Oh btw I got all my ign parts put on and got'er fired up, she sure starts better now but I havent had a chance to road test it yet, I gotta pickup new springs for the ass end, I've got a broke leaf and the box is sittin on the shed floor still from putting in fuel pumps.

Trapper 11-15-2009 09:27 PM

As with any miracle in a bottle, it's too good to be true. The issue with using any acetone in your gasoline to get more power or fuel mileage is you would have to use it quickly. Acetone is HOT. Meaning that it evaporates extremely fast like IP alcohol. It will evaporate out of the gas just as fast and is wicked away by the emissions system into the vapor canister and then thru the intake as a gas, not a liquid. The articles supposition on the octane rating and how it effects combustion is a stretch and frankly, doesn't apply. IN BASICS, gasoline formulations are made up of two different chain length molecules. One is Heptane which is a 7 length chain molecule. It's characteristics used in gas formulations is that it is unstable and easily ignited when compressed. It is used to ignite the gas charge in the cylinder. The other is an 8 chain molecule called Octane. Octane does not want to ignite under compression and relies on the Heptane to set it off. The octane rating of the gas you buy is not the amount of available energy but the resistance to ignition. A higher compression engine requires a higher octane fuel to eliminate detonation. So the percentage of octane is higher or as we say, it's a higher octane gas. Using a fuel of a higher octane rating THAN REQUIRES/RECOMMENDED in an engine will only create issues. It will have the flame front slow to form and emissions will go up creating other issues for components of the vehicle. His comments about alcohol concerning the absorption of water are correct. But an engine designed to work on ethanol can actually produce more power via a much higher compression ratio that is now allowable in the design along with more aggressive timing curves. An ethanol designed engine is also more environmentally friendly. Problem about using this technology is distribution of the fuel and confusion at the pump. Introducing regular gas into an ethanol engine is more catastrophic than putting diesel in a gas engine. I would also suggest you ignore the comments about cheap no-name gas being better. Part of the additive package of Top Tier gas are cleaners that keep the injection and intake system relatively clean. The no-name fuels generally do have these and damage can be done to your engine using them. I'd suggest using a name brand quality gas of the correct octane rating and enjoy the ride.

dr_bowtie 11-15-2009 10:25 PM

you can buy Acetone and Xylene at any painting store....Like Sherwin Williams...or the like...

Problem with Acetone and Xylene...if you use too much or pour it in your tank without mixing it into gas it WILL turn the rubber piece of hose that is between the Fuel Pump and sender unit into MUSH and then you'll have fuel that doesnt go into the fuel lines but back into the tank....

you dont want to know how many tanks I have dropped from people adding this...Gumout Fuel Injection cleaner is ACETONE...

Nick1996 11-15-2009 11:13 PM

i agree with trapper, but a higher octane is dyno proven to increase HP and MPG. The biggest difference you can make, as stated in the begging of the article is to have smaller molecules of fuel. getting aftermarket performance injectors will increase the amount of burnt fuel as it will mix better with the smaller oxygen molecules. good clean air and a fanned out high PSI fuel injector is the way to go. rather than increasing burn ratio by octane. Personal opinion with a little fact to back it up =)

ymeski56 11-15-2009 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trapper (Post 310601)
As with any miracle in a bottle, it's too good to be true. The issue with using any acetone in your gasoline to get more power or fuel mileage is you would have to use it quickly. Acetone is HOT. Meaning that it evaporates extremely fast like IP alcohol. It will evaporate out of the gas just as fast and is wicked away by the emissions system into the vapor canister and then thru the intake as a gas, not a liquid. The articles supposition on the octane rating and how it effects combustion is a stretch and frankly, doesn't apply. IN BASICS, gasoline formulations are made up of two different chain length molecules. One is Heptane which is a 7 length chain molecule. It's characteristics used in gas formulations is that it is unstable and easily ignited when compressed. It is used to ignite the gas charge in the cylinder. The other is an 8 chain molecule called Octane. Octane does not want to ignite under compression and relies on the Heptane to set it off. The octane rating of the gas you buy is not the amount of available energy but the resistance to ignition. A higher compression engine requires a higher octane fuel to eliminate detonation. So the percentage of octane is higher or as we say, it's a higher octane gas. Using a fuel of a higher octane rating THAN REQUIRES/RECOMMENDED in an engine will only create issues. It will have the flame front slow to form and emissions will go up creating other issues for components of the vehicle. His comments about alcohol concerning the absorption of water are correct. But an engine designed to work on ethanol can actually produce more power via a much higher compression ratio that is now allowable in the design along with more aggressive timing curves. An ethanol designed engine is also more environmentally friendly. Problem about using this technology is distribution of the fuel and confusion at the pump. Introducing regular gas into an ethanol engine is more catastrophic than putting diesel in a gas engine. I would also suggest you ignore the comments about cheap no-name gas being better. Part of the additive package of Top Tier gas are cleaners that keep the injection and intake system relatively clean. The no-name fuels generally do have these and damage can be done to your engine using them. I'd suggest using a name brand quality gas of the correct octane rating and enjoy the ride.

I disagree w/ your opinion about Acetone, only for the reason that I have used it in quite a few vehicles including my motorcycle, all w/ similar results. If I could chalk it up to the power of wishful thinking, I would have quit using it 10 years ago. But I agree with your arguments pertaining to Octane, ethanol, Fuel qualities, their additives and their availability to the general public. It's hard to get some people to understand that 87 octane actually has much better overall combustive properties that 91. That it's all about Compression or the rate there of. Many a Cat Converter has been murdered by 91 octane, by only partial or incomplete ignition in engines w/ low compression rates. The part of the article regarding octane that you take issue with, I must have missed as I mentioned prior, I skip read the article. Anyway your input regarding this topic is refreshing at the least! Where have you been hiding. I guess it took a little Acetone to flush you out! You would have to agree it at least did a good job doing that!


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