P0016 Eco Timing Chain?
#101
The reason I asked is because I just bought a used 2012 with 86000 miles on it and the carfax report said there had been some work done to the cams at 62K. Long story short I talked to the previous owner and the dealer that did the work and they said the chain, guilds and phazers were all replaced 5 months before the new timing chain came out. Started fine at the dealer, ran really good to. Took it home where it sat for one week and when I fired it up it had the timing chain rattle. I was pretty pissed!
From talking to the previous owner the first 2 oil changes were done by the dealer after that he changed it every 7-10K with moble one full synthetic. He said it at 62K it got P0016 code and he quit driving it for a month until the dealer finally agreed to fix it.
I changed the oil in it as soon as I got it home with moble one full synthetic. Then put about 500 miles on it and noticed that the oil level had moved about a 1/4" above the full hole on the dip stick. Although the rattle never came back in the 500 miles my conclusion was that this truck had the fuel in the oil issue and the long duration oil changes took out the timing chain. (just a guess) I than replaced the high pressure fuel pump and changed the oil again. I'm currently watching the level to see if it rises. I have let it sit up to a week and a half(not my primary vehicle) and the rattle has not returned.
I’m going to call the dealer back that did the work on the chain and see if they will e-mail me a complete list of everything they replaced on this truck. I will keep you guys updated with what I find out.
From talking to the previous owner the first 2 oil changes were done by the dealer after that he changed it every 7-10K with moble one full synthetic. He said it at 62K it got P0016 code and he quit driving it for a month until the dealer finally agreed to fix it.
I changed the oil in it as soon as I got it home with moble one full synthetic. Then put about 500 miles on it and noticed that the oil level had moved about a 1/4" above the full hole on the dip stick. Although the rattle never came back in the 500 miles my conclusion was that this truck had the fuel in the oil issue and the long duration oil changes took out the timing chain. (just a guess) I than replaced the high pressure fuel pump and changed the oil again. I'm currently watching the level to see if it rises. I have let it sit up to a week and a half(not my primary vehicle) and the rattle has not returned.
I’m going to call the dealer back that did the work on the chain and see if they will e-mail me a complete list of everything they replaced on this truck. I will keep you guys updated with what I find out.
#102
EB FX4 EcoRaptor
The reason I asked is because I just bought a used 2012 with 86000 miles on it and the carfax report said there had been some work done to the cams at 62K. Long story short I talked to the previous owner and the dealer that did the work and they said the chain, guilds and phazers were all replaced 5 months before the new timing chain came out. Started fine at the dealer, ran really good to. Took it home where it sat for one week and when I fired it up it had the timing chain rattle. I was pretty pissed!
From talking to the previous owner the first 2 oil changes were done by the dealer after that he changed it every 7-10K with moble one full synthetic. He said it at 62K it got P0016 code and he quit driving it for a month until the dealer finally agreed to fix it.
I changed the oil in it as soon as I got it home with moble one full synthetic. Then put about 500 miles on it and noticed that the oil level had moved about a 1/4" above the full hole on the dip stick. Although the rattle never came back in the 500 miles my conclusion was that this truck had the fuel in the oil issue and the long duration oil changes took out the timing chain. (just a guess) I than replaced the high pressure fuel pump and changed the oil again. I'm currently watching the level to see if it rises. I have let it sit up to a week and a half(not my primary vehicle) and the rattle has not returned.
I’m going to call the dealer back that did the work on the chain and see if they will e-mail me a complete list of everything they replaced on this truck. I will keep you guys updated with what I find out.
From talking to the previous owner the first 2 oil changes were done by the dealer after that he changed it every 7-10K with moble one full synthetic. He said it at 62K it got P0016 code and he quit driving it for a month until the dealer finally agreed to fix it.
I changed the oil in it as soon as I got it home with moble one full synthetic. Then put about 500 miles on it and noticed that the oil level had moved about a 1/4" above the full hole on the dip stick. Although the rattle never came back in the 500 miles my conclusion was that this truck had the fuel in the oil issue and the long duration oil changes took out the timing chain. (just a guess) I than replaced the high pressure fuel pump and changed the oil again. I'm currently watching the level to see if it rises. I have let it sit up to a week and a half(not my primary vehicle) and the rattle has not returned.
I’m going to call the dealer back that did the work on the chain and see if they will e-mail me a complete list of everything they replaced on this truck. I will keep you guys updated with what I find out.
And Yes, same for me, my daily start-up "rattling" disappeared when shifting with top quality synthetic oil with the OEM Ford oil filter and having replace it each 5-6Kkm (3500 miles). Perhaps, I still noticed some "rattling" at start when truck sits for one week or more but I don't really care anymore.
My chain replacement only deleted the P0016 code related to its stretch and didn't had a lot of influence on the "rattling" other than reducing its noise a bit.
I think you guessed right that the chain stretch is related to the fuel contamination in the oil and where there isn't any more viscosity; wearing excessively all moving parts during this extended oil change at 7-10K miles?
My question for you is HOW can this high pressure direct injection engine can pour some fuel in the oil at this rate, raising your dip stick 1/4" in 500 miles? From leaking fuel pump? Injectors? Leaking piston rings?
This is a lot! Raising oil level near 1/4" require more than half a pint!! This is "washing" your motor on a continuous base.. And degrading the oil viscosity in the same time frame.
Thanks to keep us updated on what you or your dealer will find on this issue.
Last edited by Salinger; 06-26-2015 at 09:50 AM. Reason: Updated
#103
The timing chain on my truck was replaced in April of 2014. I thought I read somewhere that the new updated chain wasn't available until October of 2014. Thats why I want to see if the dealer that did the work will email me all the part numbers of the work done. As far as the fuel in the oil I read the seal on the high pressure fuel pump can fail so I started with that. Worse case I have a spare($270 ebay). I guess I could rig up some fittings and pressurize it with nitrogen and look for leaks on the old one. Are the injectors known to contribute to this also?
#104
EB FX4 EcoRaptor
The timing chain on my truck was replaced in April of 2014. I thought I read somewhere that the new updated chain wasn't available until October of 2014. Thats why I want to see if the dealer that did the work will email me all the part numbers of the work done. As far as the fuel in the oil I read the seal on the high pressure fuel pump can fail so I started with that. Worse case I have a spare($270 ebay). I guess I could rig up some fittings and pressurize it with nitrogen and look for leaks on the old one. Are the injectors known to contribute to this also?
I suppose that a bad fuel pump seal makes sense to "fill-up" the oil level since pump is partially located under the cams cover. Also, a "stuck open" injector can wash out a cylinder by pouring continuously some fuel, perhaps on this issue, I would expect that an O2 sensor or fouled spark plug would flash-on a OBDII code?
Last edited by Salinger; 06-27-2015 at 07:18 AM.
#105
No codes, It runs great! I just read on another forum some guys had oil 2" over full on the dip stick and had black smoke out the exhaust. So I guess I shouldn't jump the gun yet. I will keep an eye on the level and sent in a oil sample for analysis at 3000 miles and see what the results are.
#106
Short trips and constant restarts like going to the neighborhood convenience store etc. won't allow the motor to heat up constantly and remove the gasoline injected rich cold running and change over the fuel system to warmed up lean injection so it continues to inject rich. Take the truck daily on a 20 minute 45 mph + drive so the catz temps and lean injection are working together. This will boil away the gas in the motor oil dilution to the greater degree.
Last edited by papa tiger; 06-30-2015 at 10:10 PM.
#107
I also read about short trips being bad for the ecoboost. The shortest trip I have made with this truck since I bought is 20 miles. Like I said, it’s not my primary vehicle so I don’t drive it that often. I did get my oil sample containers in the mail today so Im ready when I get 3000 miles on this oil change.
#108
Senior Member
It's a very interesting theory. Basically the slack chain takes out the phaser which now makes noise. Replacing the phaser solves the noise, but doesn't clear the code because the chain is also defective. The noise comes back a week later because only one of the phasers was replaced and the other one, already damaged, continues to get worse.
I'm going to start to push to see if I can't get them to replace the phasers under the repair warranty. Could be a long fight, but we'll see what happens...
I'm going to start to push to see if I can't get them to replace the phasers under the repair warranty. Could be a long fight, but we'll see what happens...
Well, low and behold the service manger has now been replaced. And he was replaced by my service writer! Just got off the phone with them and as a goodwill measure the dealership is going to replace the drivers side phaser on their dime!
I asked that since they are already digging into the engine if I could buy the parts and have them install a new timing chain as well. He was agreeable to doing this and wanted to research the change in part numbers to see if it was a part or just a manufacturer change. I'm tempted to put a new passenger side phaser in as well, but I'm not sure of the cost associated with this.
Could this be the permanent fix that has eluded others????
#109
Probably most often event just as diesel fuel pump seal leak: Copy from above entry.
Noticed that the oil level had moved about a 1/4" above the full hole on the dip stick. Although the rattle never came back in the 500 miles my conclusion was that this truck had the fuel in the oil issue and the long duration oil changes took out the timing chain. I than replaced the high pressure fuel pump and changed the oil again !
Noticed that the oil level had moved about a 1/4" above the full hole on the dip stick. Although the rattle never came back in the 500 miles my conclusion was that this truck had the fuel in the oil issue and the long duration oil changes took out the timing chain. I than replaced the high pressure fuel pump and changed the oil again !
Last edited by papa tiger; 07-13-2015 at 11:46 AM.
#110
Thought this is interesting even if not the 3.5EB timing set up it is still informative.