Radiator Fluid Question
12-14-2008, 08:18 PM
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Radiator Fluid Question
I have a 1995 Ford F-150 with 244,000 miles on it. Yes, and it runs like a top. Bought it a few months ago and only drive it on Saturdays...and even then, its just to Lowe's and back. Just what I wanted and need.
It has developed a problem: a radiator fluid leak...but not from the radiator.
You'll be able to tell I know little about automobiles/trucks...but it appears to be leaking from behind the radiator at the front of the engine block..the 3 wheels for the belts?....it seems to drip from one of those....I think.
What am I looking at? Adding some engine sealant? It also makes a funny noise behind the glove compartment---like water rushing in and out...but there is no leak there.
ANY HELP would be appreciated....thanks!
It has developed a problem: a radiator fluid leak...but not from the radiator.
You'll be able to tell I know little about automobiles/trucks...but it appears to be leaking from behind the radiator at the front of the engine block..the 3 wheels for the belts?....it seems to drip from one of those....I think.
What am I looking at? Adding some engine sealant? It also makes a funny noise behind the glove compartment---like water rushing in and out...but there is no leak there.
ANY HELP would be appreciated....thanks!
12-14-2008, 08:23 PM
#2
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Look carefully, because this could either be really easy, or it could be a big deal.
On the front of the motor, toward the top, you'll see a hose from the radiator connected. If it's leaking from there, it could just be the gasket on the thermostat housing. That's the easy one...
If it's down lower, where one of the pulleys is, that's more than likely the water pump, which is a much more involved job.
Stop-leak additives are a great way to cause more problems than you already have.
On the front of the motor, toward the top, you'll see a hose from the radiator connected. If it's leaking from there, it could just be the gasket on the thermostat housing. That's the easy one...
If it's down lower, where one of the pulleys is, that's more than likely the water pump, which is a much more involved job.
Stop-leak additives are a great way to cause more problems than you already have.
12-14-2008, 09:09 PM
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With that many miles on the engine, lots of possibilities as to where it could be leaking from. If I had to place a bet, I would say it's from your water pump though. Water pumps have "weep holes" in them. When the pump goes bad, cooling fluid begins to leak slowly when it's running.
Speaking from recent experience, it can be a real pain to see if your pump is leaking from the weep hole, and with such a high mileage engine, it might be worth it to have the block pressure tested. It's not too expensive (can't remember off the top of my head, but less than $50) and whoever does it will be able to show you any external leaks you may have.
If it is the pump, as mine recently was, a replacement is $40-$80. If you're at all inclined to learn about your truck, it's an opportunity to save more than $300 in labor (from Pep Boys at least).
Speaking from recent experience, it can be a real pain to see if your pump is leaking from the weep hole, and with such a high mileage engine, it might be worth it to have the block pressure tested. It's not too expensive (can't remember off the top of my head, but less than $50) and whoever does it will be able to show you any external leaks you may have.
If it is the pump, as mine recently was, a replacement is $40-$80. If you're at all inclined to learn about your truck, it's an opportunity to save more than $300 in labor (from Pep Boys at least).
12-14-2008, 09:46 PM
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Thanks much gents!
Should it be the water pump---I'd like to take an opportunity to learn from this....any books or on-line places you could recommend which would provide directions on replacing the pump?
Should it be the water pump---I'd like to take an opportunity to learn from this....any books or on-line places you could recommend which would provide directions on replacing the pump?
12-14-2008, 10:33 PM
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i had the same thing happen on both 95's i had with the 5.8L ... it was the lower radiator hose that has the oil cooler setup... i thought it was the water pump too at first til i put it on a lift... the bottom hose is a 2 piece setup that is connected in the middle with plastic and it gets worn out... if its leaking from the backside its really hard to see unless the truck is in the air and ur directly looking up at it... once it leaks onto the hose the fan kinda splatters it arounnd and its hard to find where exactly its leaking from... and those 2 pieces were not cheap ... even with my UPS mechanic discount they were $120 bucks together!
Last edited by dustin9779; 12-14-2008 at 10:35 PM.
12-14-2008, 11:05 PM
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Most standard Chiltons or Haynes manuals give you a more-than-adequate play by play on how it's done for this procedure. I think there were less than 10 bolts total for the whole job. Once you get past the fan it will (probably) go simply and quickly. I pulled the radiator just to hose all the crap out of it, but I don't think that's mandatory. You will want to get your hands on the wrench set necessary to remove the fan. It's a combination of wrenches that are purpose specific (not good for much else) and usually cost more than the pump itself. Look for a parts store with loaner tools.
I talked smack about Pep Boys in my earlier post, but the truth is that the same guys that wanted $400 for the pump job were equally as eager to sell me just the pump and loan me the tools to do the job myself.
I talked smack about Pep Boys in my earlier post, but the truth is that the same guys that wanted $400 for the pump job were equally as eager to sell me just the pump and loan me the tools to do the job myself.
Last edited by bjafeman; 12-15-2008 at 03:06 PM.
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12-15-2008, 05:29 PM
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So... what about the water noise behind the glove box (heater core)? Has anyone else encountered this? Mine is making the same noise and I'm wondering what the heck is going on. I've tried 'burping' the radiator thinking there were air bubbles, but no luck. Is this a sign of a failing heater core?
12-15-2008, 07:05 PM
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$80 for a water pump??? IIRC, I paid $30 for one for my 96. I changed mine a year or so ago, and then ended up replacing the radiator. Cooling systems are notorious for that type of non-sense: fix the biggest leak, and then the next biggest leak starts to bother you. It all started when I decided to flush the cooling system - no good deed goes unpunished 
The truth is, I had a lot of fun doing it, though it got a little old driving (my car had the wisdom to stay clear of the wrenches) for the next part.
Not meaning to scare you, I am not certain I would have wanted to try the water pump as a first job. Not that I am any master mechanic, but I had at least done some small engine work (mostly undoing terrible and stupid things I had done to lawnmowers), shocks, and replaced the truck's thermostat when I tried it. I thought I was ready, and apparently I was; it was challenging but I never felt completely swamped by it. If you read carefully, ask questions when something seems out of whack, and promise not to cut corners, it is probably ok. IIRC, a friend of mine started out (long ago) with a water pump, so it can be done.
Getting the right wrenches for my fan clutch was the worst part; I ended up needing pieces from two different kits. Then, you need to figure out which way to turn the thing to losen it - assuming it's like mine. I got a very authoritative (and just plain WRONG) response on alt.trucks.ford, so be warned.
I recommend at least renting/borrowing a radiator pressure tester; I bought one and have not regretted it. A beam-type torque wrench is a good idea; some might suggest that it is avoidable, and it probably is. However, it is nice to have a guide. One thing about removing a bolt: you have to put it back, and that means you will eventually have to figure out when to stop cranking on it. A torque wrench helps.
One thing I learned by experience: when you install the new pump, it is possible to have it slightly out of position without realizing it. On my truck, the pump has a dogleg tube that heads up and back toward the heater core (one of the two hoses goes on it); it has a simpler sibling for the other heater hose. That tube will clear everything just fine, but it would be a good idea to put a chuck of heater hose on it because the additional diameter might interfere with a bracket that the tube alone will clear. In my case, the RTV sealant had only been in place for 30 minutes or so when I found the problem, and I was able to back off the bolts, reposition the pump and torque it again without messing up the gasket. However, it would have been better to skip that step.
I have read differing opinions on oil additives for old engines, but stop-leak is no way to fix a water pump. Do you hear any squeaking? That is another sign of trouble. I would mention a mechanic's stethoscope, but I do not consider them safe for water pumps - the fan is in the way. They're great for other accessories though, and with respect for the fan, belt, other moving stuff, and any exposed 12V contacts (grounding them with a conductor is bad form), you can rule out other sources of sound. However, if the weep holes are leaking, the pump is bad.
Good luck!
Bill
The truth is, I had a lot of fun doing it, though it got a little old driving (my car had the wisdom to stay clear of the wrenches) for the next part.Not meaning to scare you, I am not certain I would have wanted to try the water pump as a first job. Not that I am any master mechanic, but I had at least done some small engine work (mostly undoing terrible and stupid things I had done to lawnmowers), shocks, and replaced the truck's thermostat when I tried it. I thought I was ready, and apparently I was; it was challenging but I never felt completely swamped by it. If you read carefully, ask questions when something seems out of whack, and promise not to cut corners, it is probably ok. IIRC, a friend of mine started out (long ago) with a water pump, so it can be done.
Getting the right wrenches for my fan clutch was the worst part; I ended up needing pieces from two different kits. Then, you need to figure out which way to turn the thing to losen it - assuming it's like mine. I got a very authoritative (and just plain WRONG) response on alt.trucks.ford, so be warned.
I recommend at least renting/borrowing a radiator pressure tester; I bought one and have not regretted it. A beam-type torque wrench is a good idea; some might suggest that it is avoidable, and it probably is. However, it is nice to have a guide. One thing about removing a bolt: you have to put it back, and that means you will eventually have to figure out when to stop cranking on it. A torque wrench helps.
One thing I learned by experience: when you install the new pump, it is possible to have it slightly out of position without realizing it. On my truck, the pump has a dogleg tube that heads up and back toward the heater core (one of the two hoses goes on it); it has a simpler sibling for the other heater hose. That tube will clear everything just fine, but it would be a good idea to put a chuck of heater hose on it because the additional diameter might interfere with a bracket that the tube alone will clear. In my case, the RTV sealant had only been in place for 30 minutes or so when I found the problem, and I was able to back off the bolts, reposition the pump and torque it again without messing up the gasket. However, it would have been better to skip that step.
I have read differing opinions on oil additives for old engines, but stop-leak is no way to fix a water pump. Do you hear any squeaking? That is another sign of trouble. I would mention a mechanic's stethoscope, but I do not consider them safe for water pumps - the fan is in the way. They're great for other accessories though, and with respect for the fan, belt, other moving stuff, and any exposed 12V contacts (grounding them with a conductor is bad form), you can rule out other sources of sound. However, if the weep holes are leaking, the pump is bad.
Good luck!
Bill